2.4 Main Story Revilations *SPOILERS*

[Sapphic]

If she is Garlean, what if she left the Empire and wants to fight against it? We don't know her motives quite well yet. Heck I'm not even that far into the story to know, but from what I've read online.

Blaming the Empire for Gauis death? Believing that if the Empire had thrown their full support behind him, he wouldn't have been defeated? Or simply that she cannot return home upon pain of death.

[Renvalt]

Cid being the other Garlean who has proven their loyalty, whos to say she didn't also.

The Three City-States are a lot more lenient. Ishgarde isn't.

Besides, it can't be Livia for several reasons.

-Her voice patterns don't match up. The pitch and tone of her voice differs from Lucia's. Lucia's voice is far deeper, and I couldn't hear the same woman in Livia.
-She was at the very doorstep of Castrum Meridianum. If the Immortal Flames Coalition didn't capture her during their takeover of the place, then she would've been incinerated in the blast caused by Ultima (which the game amazingly does not reflect - nice of you not to use phasing where it really counts, eh Yoshida?)
-Assuming she WAS captured, I doubt the Flames would've let her live. Her crimes were heavier leaning towards Ul'Dah than any other city state (besides Noraxia's death, but the Sylphs told us to pass judgement to her).

And to people saying that Nero surviving was precedent, you're forgetting - he was still alive after we kicked his ass, and he used the cover of darkness brought by the power outage to get the hell out of there. Given the time between us fighting Gaius and the first Ultima going off, I'd say he had just enough time to get away - saving Livia would've only slowed him down (and Nero appears to be the type of dude that only cares about himself).

[Vejjiegirl]

During her introduction, she stares at the main character and said something very curious...
(Screenshots in the Spoiler tags)

She then looks at the player character and there is a pause.

"Those who dwell in the past risk losing sight in their future."

[lilirulu]

snip

- I'm curious if she ever spoke outside of battle? I can't remember. And if her VA doesn't match up well she could have gotten a new one too.
- The area we fought Livia was the gate to the preatorium. And only roughly half of Preatorium was destroyed by Ultima and Castrum was completely untouched so she could have escaped through a back entrance, hidden passage, airship, etc.
- I was the using the precedent that Livia of all the generals that died was the only one who didn't get shown dieing in a explicitly 'you aren't coming back from this' sort of way. The roe general was electrocuted and Gaius was blown up. Livia fell over and she could have very well just collapsed from her injuries.
- Assuming she was captured (doubtful because the story never mentioned that so it's most likely she wasn't) the game has long since established a precedent for jail guards being murdered off-screen or tricked. Foulques (LNC quests), the KoM antagonist from the ARC quests, Eline Roaille all did it.

Edit: Actually checking the journals & quest dialogue not once do they ever mention that Livia is dead only defeated. For Gaius and the roe they use explicit terms like 'death-blow', 'demise', and 'slain'. Never once do they use such terms for Livia. The closest we get is from Cid with 'May her soul know rest'.

[Renvalt]

-snip-

-She speaks during the story at the Waking Sands raid and during Minfilia's interrogation @ Castrum Centri. So there's precedent. I'd say Lucia sounds a lot like Tara Strong (her voice as Drakengard 3's Zero especially gives me the throwback here). Then again, Alisson Lees Taylor may be attempting to channel Tara, but this sounds.... too unconvincing.
-That gate was also right out front of the Praetorium, if memory serves. You couldn't just waltz up the front door - you had to enter via airship. That was the least guarded of places to get in and wreck Ultima Weapon.
-Not everyone needs to die in a uber dramatic fashion to be confirmed dead. Why that's somehow an expectation from storytelling, I have zero idea.
-If Livia had been captured, she would've been executed on the spot. Eline couldn't risk playing her hand that early - she was working for Varis and not Gaius (the latter of whose presence and ambitions were unsanctioned by the former). And I really think Cid would've noticed if she were still alive - the corpse was right in front of him the entire time. Not to mention they'd let the body become vulture feed in this case - if her body went missing, it'd raise suspicions.
-Cid was in the room with the Iron Giant boss during our little fight with Nero. The only view of the fight he had was via the control room and that view was cut off twice; once by Nero just before he brings down the Gunhammer and again when Ultima Weapon turns on causing a temporary blackout throughout the entire Praetorium.


Has anyone compared the heights, anyways? I don't recall Livia being taller than Minfilia, and I'm curious how tall Lucia is compared to the two of them. That might help tell us if they're the same person (Lucia and Livia, anyways).

On a final note: Lucia's words prior to that whole bit is typical Ishgardian banter. They're very cold and untrusting for a reason - Dravanians are known to use one's sentiments against them. Fake Guillarme did it with one of the guards in Whitebrim, so what's stopping any other Dravanian bastard from doing it too?

[Morningstar1337]

-Not everyone needs to die in a uber dramatic fashion to be confirmed dead. Why that's somehow an expectation from storytelling, I have zero idea.

Probably because it's somehow ingrained into our subconscious that dying in a "mundane" fashion where the body is unseen, leaves open a possibility that the deceased is actualy alive. The problem is very prevalent in games, especially MMOs, where player characters die and get revived on a regular basis

See: He's Just Hiding and Never Found the Body

[lilirulu]

-snip-

- You are correct. The voice do not match up in the slightest. I still, however, have to point out that there could have been a VA change especially considering Livia's VA hasn't had workwith FFXIV since the original 2.0 which was over a year ago. I'm not saying that is the case but it is a possibility.

- I'm confused what you mean here? The gate was located at the very back of the Castrum and then there was still a significant distance still between the two. It was plenty enough distance away from Preatorium when Ultima went off. Which from a second look only destroyed the the whole of preatorium up to it's outmost walls then stopped.

- No, not everyone needs to die in a dramatic way. But when the game has set a precedent for dramatic deaths of important human NPCs I'm going to notice one when it's not. A quick list of deaths to show you what I mean:

• Foulques - Fell off a cliff
• Nael (T9) - Light spear through the chest
• Roe General (Cape Westwind) - Electrocuted
• Gaius (Preatorium) - Blow up/crushed during the collapse of Preatorium
• Tristan (SMN 50 quest) - Blown up by Belias-Egi
• BLM Teacher - Dissipated into smoke.

And there are probably more I'm not even remembering.

- Why would she be executed on the spot? She's valuable for the information that could be extracted from her. I think they'd keep her alive long enough to make a show of her death and extract information at least.

- I'm totally lost at what you are trying to say with this point?

- Lucia isn't Ishgardian. She's a foreigner. And as a foreigner it seems unlikely she'd adopt the Ishgard's mistrust of outsiders because she is one. Especially considering Aymeric is much more open to outsiders then the Holy See.

Aaaaand: I did in fact compare Lucia's height to Livia, Minfilia and my Lalafell (shortest height).

Edit: Removed link because I mismeasured the picture.

[Astrid_Stormborn]

Sorry to break up the debate quickly, but can I ask what were the words that came up at the end of the story arc? My mother came in to talk about something and I missed it. Unfortunately those don't come up in the cutscene viewer either.

[Alice_89th]

Sorry to break up the debate quickly, but can I ask what were the words that came up at the end of the story arc? My mother came in to talk about something and I missed it. Unfortunately those don't come up in the cutscene viewer either.

Here you go

[Naraku_Diabolos]

Blaming the Empire for Gauis death? Believing that if the Empire had thrown their full support behind him, he wouldn't have been defeated? Or simply that she cannot return home upon pain of death.

I'm talking about Lucia.