about egi's models

[melflomil]

10-08-2013 02:07 PM

Complain enough and the design team will have no choice but to eat their words and change the appearances. Not enough people care on the subject so they will not do anything.

[Exstal]

Complain enough and the design team will have no choice but to eat their words and change the appearances. Not enough people care on the subject so they will not do anything.

How very right you are. However, there needs to be enough of an outcry to have anything changed. Look at WAR pre-2.1, for example. Everyone, WARs and people playing with them, complained about how bad the class was. They changed it. People have been complaining for a year about SMN and they have no reason to change. What's the difference? Amount of people who actually dislike the class or aesthetics of the class.

Most people is not pleased with the SMN job as a whole, we have these threads everyday. I know the answer they gave to us, but giving negative answers is the same things as ignoring the feedback, they claim to be listening, but they keep ignoring our feedback, discarding some good ideas and making their half fixes, because they know most of us aren't going anywhere...

And the same way you think using resources to fix this is a waste, i think using resources to make more dungeons and primals is also a waste, your opinion is not more important or valid than mine. But i'll give you this, it's indeed something that can be fixed slowly, without any rush, but it's not something ignorable, and if they are going to invest resources to rehash old content, i prefer them to fix SMN.

Bold - not true. Otherwise there would be significantly more threads like WAR had.

[Renik]

How very right you are. However, there needs to be enough of an outcry to have anything changed. Look at WAR pre-2.1, for example. Everyone, WARs and people playing with them, complained about how bad the class was. They changed it. People have been complaining for a year about SMN and they have no reason to change. What's the difference? Amount of people who actually dislike the class or aesthetics of the class.

Bold - not true. Otherwise there would be significantly more threads like WAR had.

WAR was a balance issue, it created preference for PLDs over WARs, and i'm not gonna take a "not true" from someone that used the "1%" also know as vocal minority excuse , if you were the producer the game would stay as it was in 2.0 forever, why don't you try to look for some signatures for"let the egis stay as flying rocks", lets see how many you can get...

[Exstal]

If I were the Producer, I would only listen to viable solutions to actual problems. I wouldn't go back, or at least try not, and fix something that wasn't broken in the first place lest I create more problems. Also, vocal minority is what forums are. That's simply how it works. If I could read French or German, I'd go take a look at their sub forums and see if they complain about the same things we do. The Japanese don't so that's already a chunk of the playerbase that doesn't vocalize the same issues that we do.

For example, there are no Atma complaint threads on the Japanese forums.

Edit: A quick browse through their threads at 5:24 EDT, nothing on the first 3 pages of General Discussion about ACN or SMN and in DPS sub-forum has one thread who was started on the English forums by Spellbinder that hasn't seen a reply since 9-15-2014.

[Renik]

snip

Vocal minority is just an internet term, it has the value of a theory, so it's not an absolute, unless you can show us real numbers none of us is wrong, you can say if the other regions are or not complaining, but you can't say if they are fully pleased with the appearance, or if they would mind about a change, not everything enters in conflict with what the players not using the forums want, and even less if the only thing the dev team have to do is create a minion like model.

Anyway, if you think the other regions feedback is more valuable, well, there have been complains about the heavy mechanic driven combat everywhere, and SE keeps refusing to tell us if there are some changes planed in the future, stop treating them like gods, because the way they work makes them ignore most of the feedback, in most cases a single person is in charge of a decision.

Also i don't know how the other forums do, but the jp forums tend to make a thread once to give feedback and forget about it, i'm sure there's a thread about egis design somewhere.

most

adjective \ˈmōst\ : almost all : the majority of
: greatest in amount or degree

(i snipped the only truth in your post)

I have seen enough analyzers like you to know that discussing with you is a waste, so i'm not even using a forum post, just gonna tell you, your post is as theoretical as mine, you can make all the numbers you want, but if there's only an absolute fact, it is that we don't know what the players out of the forums think about it, i can only state the opinions of the people i know or i have talked with.

[Dwill]

(i snipped the only truth in your post)

I have seen enough analyzers like you to know that discussing with you is a waste, so i'm not even using a forum post, just gonna tell you, your post is as theoretical as mine, you can make all the numbers you want, but if there's only an absolute fact, it is that we don't know what the players out of the forums think about it, i can only state the opinions of the people i know or i have talked with.

It's pretty hilarious that you dismiss my entire post because you don't like it and not because it's incorrect. You can't even provide one decent argument to support your point of view so in the end, thank you for proving me that you've got no legs to stand on in this debate.

By the way, because you don't like the numbers, it doesn't mean they are made up. But it's okay, keep on thinking that 10s of thousands of people agree with you if it makes you sleep at night.

I think this is OP's first.

And with his choice of words, more than likely his/her last.

[Alukah]

I like the size of egis, but that design really has to go, the current design looks very unprofessional.

[Renik]

snip

I did but your mind is unable to get it, it happens a lot in these forums, ppl ask for reasons, you give them, they read what they want and make their own interpretation. You may think your numbers are correct, but you're wrong, first, not everyone listed as a smn is a smn and not everyone listed as something else is a "non smn", this is your first mistake. The second is claiming we are minority, because only those who complain are in the forums; there are several reasons to register in these forums, first, if you want to post or like a post, if not, you just read w/o registering, theorycrafting, feedback, some will just come to rant a bit but they are far from being a majority, if i had to say who are the real vocal minority, i would say, anyone who likes forums, in other words, darama lovers, white knights and trolls, those are the real vocal minority, and they have little or nothing to do with the game, they just enjoy, opposing, correcting grammar, analyzing posts to counter them with nosesnse.

I will admit, the op is ranting, and she/he is not acting correctly, but that doesn't makes his/her point invalid, and i will go further, the reaction of the op is understandable, the OP looks like a firstimer in the forums, is not used to treating with the stress the people like you cause in others.

Before you say something about not being reasons to support my stance in my post.

- Your numbers are wrong.
- You are not majority here nor in the game.
- You used semantics and wrong numbers to invalidate my point instead of posting your opinion about the topic.
- This is a FF game, and FF fans are used to more detailed summons, i understand the size issue tho, a reduced size is needed for an MMO like this one.
- I said i have talked with a lot of ppl about this inside of the game, and even if the wrong bases made up in these forums tell you that a very reduced portion of the playerbase is not important, it's indeed a scaled representation of a whole group.
- Since the launch of SMN, there have been complains, from SMNs, yes those who play the job, a portion of the playerbase who sees this bad design as an issue, and want to register and post in the forums, in other words, a "scaled representation of a whole group."

And my final point, that i will define as a personal attack to ppl like you, whenever a feedback thread is made, i can recognize some names, people who post repeatedly on a thread trying to invalidate other's opinion making them look like a minority, and liking the posts of those with the same destructive mentality, but in the end, a vast majority supports positively the feedback threads, the reason they look like a minority is because they post an opinion and leave. Don't get me wrong, there are real opposers as well, but they do the same, post an opinion and leave.

If you were really saying the truth you would just post your opinion and leave, instead of attacking ppl with the overused statement of the vocal minority, semantics and made up or wrong numbers, leave your opinion here and let the devs and the real community decide.