Now that Nexus is out... still a good idea to put piety on Blm Novus or no?

[Numenor1379]

So here's some hard numbers to show what you all are so up in arms about...

Stats of my non-SCoB gear loadout (that is, BiS for what I've got access to with an ACC of 432 or better) as this is what I'm using most of the time:
WD - 75
INT - 576
DET - 309
CRIT - 484
SSPD - 484

With those numbers, here are the DPS numbers for the T1 and T2 rotations:

T1 B --
Raw Damage + CRIT: 107809
Raw DPS + CRIT: 412.8

T2 B --
Raw Damage + CRIT: 109120
Raw DPS + CRIT: 412.3

WOW! A whole 0.5dps... a whopping 0.125% difference between the two rotations!

Now let's add 8 DET and see what happens...

T1 B (+8DET) --
Raw Damage: 108163
Raw DPS + CRIT: 414.1

T2 B (+8DET) --
Raw Damage: 109478
Raw DPS + CRIT: 413.6

Amazing... 1.3dps increase for the top rotation, a HUGE 0.31% increase in DPS output.

Let's try +8 CRIT and see...

T1 B (+8CRIT) --
Raw Damage: 108076
Raw DPS + CRIT: 413.8

T2 B (+8CRIT) --
Raw Damage: 109390
Raw DPS + CRIT: 413.3

A MASSIVE 1dps increase over my current stats for the T1 B rotation.

Max Total damage difference is 354... or roughly 1/3 of a Fire 1 cast.

Yeah, my Novus is SOOOOOO gimped and useless isn't it? </sarcasm>

As I suspected early on in this thread the DPS difference is negligible. An extra crit on any spell on any of the lower stats/T2 rotations easily wipes out the DPS difference. Hell, getting lucky on not having a plume under you so you don't have to move will make a larger DPS difference than these stats will.

Get the burrs out of your rears, numbers this small only mean something if you use a parser and can easily be wiped out by RNG or human error. Sure, you can always say 1dps more is 1dps more. But you know, as I do, that there is no practical or real life difference between these numbers. No one will ever notice you doing 1dps more or less w/o running that parser, and in the end the monster will be dead at the same time anyways.

[SeraviEdalborez]

Yeah, my Novus is SOOOOOO gimped and useless isn't it? </sarcasm>

As I suspected early on in this thread the DPS difference is negligible. An extra crit on any spell on any of the lower stats/T2 rotations easily wipes out the DPS difference. Hell, getting lucky on not having a plume under you so you don't have to move will make a larger DPS difference than these stats will.

Get the burrs out of your rears, numbers this small only mean something if you use a parser and can easily be wiped out by RNG or human error. Sure, you can always say 1dps more is 1dps more. But you know, as I do, that there is no practical or real life difference between these numbers.

Some of our main reasons (no SCH, solo content, "more flexible") are silly reasons to put PIE in, considering you could have instead put 8crit on there if you really didn't want to or couldn't afford to cap Det. Solo content is a joke, and "more flexible" is a cop-out reason given that you can adjust your rotation on the fly instead of speccing to always have enough PIE to adhere to the script (when, as mentioned like a dozen times now, you could just use Thunder 1 and never have to worry about PIE). Coil isn't the only content, but in what content that matters do you need enough PIE all the time? You don't.

Literally the one good point to be made of PIE is hitting 250 to be able to do Convert > F2 > Flare for trash mob AoE. Which you can instead do Convert > F1 > Flare regardless of MP, or Convert > F2 > B3 or whatever if you don't have enough. Because trash mob AoE efficiency down to the level of "do I have enough PIE" is not that important. For a single-target rotation it doesn't matter at all.

You instead keep harping on about how it isn't a big deal. It isn't. But your Novus is basically now just a HA staff in terms of "you wasted some secondaries".

[StouterTaru]

How on earth does it let you be more flexible with your rotation. If anything, T1+B1 is more flexible than T2 because if you get a quick mana tick, you go into Fire phase without B1, if you get a slow tick, you do a B1 (or a scathe if you need to move).

T2 is less DPS, less flexible with movement (due to the longer cast), and less flexible with mana ticks.

Casting Blizzard I drops your dps by as much as standing still not casting anything for almost a full second.

You still have the ability to cast B1 after T2 if you get a slow UI tick, it will just happen much less often.

------

And while we're at it, higher spell speed doesn't make you get interrupted fewer times, it increases the number of spells you crank out, so you are interrupted a lower percentage of your cast time.

6 fire rotation only takes 369 PIE, that's only a loss of 11 INT and ~10 secondary stats in a party with SCH. Yes, that does include food and novus stat losses.

[Alistaire]

And while we're at it, higher spell speed doesn't make you get interrupted fewer times, it increases the number of spells you crank out, so you are interrupted a lower percentage of your cast time.

6 fire rotation only takes 369 PIE, that's only a loss of 11 INT and ~10 secondary stats in a party with SCH. Yes, that does include food and novus stat losses.

You're neglecting that aside from the higher # of spells each spell has a smaller window of being interrupted, since you won't be interrupted if you're at somehin like 80% cast (I forget the exact figure).

Edit: and as soon as you start including INT losses to accomplish more PIE you should probably just quit BLM.

[StouterTaru]

You're neglecting that aside from the higher # of spells each spell has a smaller window of being interrupted, since you won't be interrupted if you're at somehin like 80% cast (I forget the exact figure).

Edit: and as soon as you start including INT losses to accomplish more PIE you should probably just quit BLM.

Yes it is a smaller window per spell, but there's more of those windows. It equals out.

I'm not talking a straight INT>PIE swap on bonus attributes, and if you think 1 INT is worth more than any amount of PIE, you should just stop talking.

[SeraviEdalborez]

369 PIE is absurdly overshooting for 6fire. You can make it work with much, much less. 305 PIE will work most of the time, a little more makes it more foolproof to one particular scenario of bad UI3 tick RNG.

[StouterTaru]

369 PIE is absurdly overshooting for 6fire. You can make it work with much, much less. 305 PIE will work most of the time, a little more makes it more foolproof to one particular scenario of bad UI3 tick RNG.

That should have been 315, not 369. I was going off my PIE build as having 2 more than needed, and read 317 as 371.

302 will get you enough to use B1 after B3, before casting Thunder.
315 is what you need to go from B3 into Thunder every time.

[Kinseykinz]

In my opinion, when it comes to your 'Relic' weapon and it's upgrade path, I feel it's best to make a solid 'steady eddie' weapon and not worry about min/maxing of specific stats perse...I feel this way for ALL jobs.

Here's why:

Your relic weapon is just supposed to be your trusty all-around go to weapon you can always have, no matter how the rng gods treat you when it comes to other drops. Furthermore. since it's a weapon designed to grow WITH you, it should never really be completely useless or outdated...but this does not mean it will be 'BiS'. Just that it's a good weapon that can see you through all content until you get a BiS. Also, since it is an upgradable weapon, it will keep up with content better than other weapons, but since we have no idea what the next content's requirements might be, it's hard to say for 100% sure that maxing stats x and y over z will always be better.

Basically, the BiS weapons for your class should be the drops from the current 'high end' content...but they shouldn't last longer than a patch cycle or two as 'BiS'....a Relic weapon though w/ it's upgrades should be more than enough to clear the hardest content with and use until you can gain the BiS for that patch (if the RNG gods favor you/you desire).

Think if the Relic quest and it's upgrades as insurance....nothing more, nothing less.


But no, it is NOT worth the gil/time to min/max a Novus as there will always be weapons with the desired min/max stats otherwise available in game. Just make a good solid weapon.

The only other potential alternative to use the Novus weapons for is off-spec builds that you are doing for a very specific reason, and even then, there are likely better, less wasteful options. (+STR tank builds/PvP builds etc)

[Alistaire]

I'm not talking a straight INT>PIE swap on bonus attributes, and if you think 1 INT is worth more than any amount of PIE, you should just stop talking.

So we're agreed then. Except you haven't then explained where you're losing INT to get PIE. Two melded i90s?

But no, it is NOT worth the gil/time to min/max a Novus as there will always be weapons with the desired min/max stats otherwise available in game. Just make a good solid weapon.

True (as true as opinions can go) except for the DET weighting. A novus will potentially have 44 crit/31 det where any other i110 weapon with crit high det low would be 44 crit 22 det, or det high crit low would be 31 det 31 crit.

[dragonfire8974]

Yes it is a smaller window per spell, but there's more of those windows. It equals out.

I'm not talking a straight INT>PIE swap on bonus attributes, and if you think 1 INT is worth more than any amount of PIE, you should just stop talking.

The eps parsing was done last year comparing 5 fire rotation to 6 fire rotation and it ended up that 5 stronger fires even at ilvl 90 had higher dps. That is if I'm remembering the timeline correctly.