[Pole] Do you want to see the summoner class reworked?

[Akiza]

Definately, my problem isn't how the pets look either (even though they're ugly and poorly designed). My main issue is summoner is not even really a summoner. Its a dot class with 3 limited pets. As of now two of the pets are useless to begin with because everyone uses Garuda in everything. IMO in the future I say get rid of the entire egi system all together and just let us aquire and summon other creatures within Eorzea. Summoner could have a collection of summons to choose from and be a lot more flexible in battle deciding which creature would suit each better. However I bet the excuse for that would be "Its too complex for our players. The class used to be my main, got animus with it but I abandoned it for BLM and decided to get my novus with blm instead. So far i'm loving it, BLM feels like what its supposed to be a magical powerhouse.

Summoning creatures is encroaching on the Beasts Master and that won't work. Right now the Summoner is in Red Mage territory which is the real reason for the complaints. Get rid of the Egis because it failed hard on what the developer intended it to be since Summoner's are Garuda Masters now and replace them with toned down High Lander Hyur scaled Primals (size of Summons from Final Fantasy XII). Give the pets 8 offensive abilities with Primal move sets and Elemental theme abilities as well as 2 party wide buffs. Reduce the damage potency of the Dots and give the Summoner 2 additional Pet Buffs and 3 more Pet skills along the lines of Enkindle.

[MercuryD]

Right now the Summoner is in Red Mage territory

Yep, I won T6 because I could cast Blizzard 3, Fire 3, Stone 2, Aero 2, convert, Flare, Benediction and with my awesome sword skills... See the logic here? Red Mage hasn't been touched in the SLIGHTEST. Your logic of this series is 100% based on one single game: XI. A great game though it was RDM in it was as SMN is here: unconventional but good at it.

[Tharian]

Right now the Summoner is in Red Mage territory

Only if by "Red Mage territory" you actually mean "Debuffing territory" because that is the only aspect of the Red Mage that Summoner is encroaching on. Traditionally speaking a Red Mage is the class that uses both White and Black Magic simultaneously, though they have access to slightly weaker spells than a standard White Mage or Black Mage would have access to. It really is only in Final Fantasy XI that the Red Mage was relegated to the "Debuffer" role in most parties, and even then the Red Mage fulfilled the role of "Refresh and Phalanx spot" far more frequently than they did the "Debuffer" spot.

[Akiza]

Only if by "Red Mage territory" you actually mean "Debuffing territory" because that is the only aspect of the Red Mage that Summoner is encroaching on. Traditionally speaking a Red Mage is the class that uses both White and Black Magic simultaneously, though they have access to slightly weaker spells than a standard White Mage or Black Mage would have access to. It really is only in Final Fantasy XI that the Red Mage was relegated to the "Debuffer" role in most parties, and even then the Red Mage fulfilled the role of "Refresh and Phalanx spot" far more frequently than they did the "Debuffer" spot.

In Final Fantasy MMO's Square is never going to make the Red Mage have access to both White and Black magic since they'll be nerfed in each area so the Red Mage is relegated to the Debuffer role by default. The Summoner should primarily be a Pet role with Debuffer as a secondary role. As for the Beastmaster's future which is a Pet role just like Summoner is suppose to be and for the players that say the Summoner is fine how will you like it if Beastmaster turned out to be a Marauder with the Pet as an afterthought.

[Tharian]

In Final Fantasy MMO's Square is never going to make the Red Mage have access to both White and Black magic since they'll be nerfed in each area so the Red Mage is relegated to the Debuffer role by default. The Summoner should primarily be a Pet role with Debuffer as a secondary role. As for Beastmaster in the future which is a Pet role just like Summoner is suppose to be and for the players that say the Summoner is fine how will you like it if Beastmaster turned out to be a Marauder with the Pet as an afterthought.

ROFLMAO. "In Final Fantasy MMO's" what are you talking about? Square-Enix has in fact made THREE classes in a Final Fantasy MMO that have significant access to both White and Black Magic. In Final Fantasy XI the Red Mage, Scholar, and Geomancer all have access to both White and Black Magic to varying degree's. So don't you go telling me that it would never happen in a Final Fantasy MMO. And no, the Scholar of Final Fantasy XI has absolutely nothing in common with the Scholar of Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn aside from their fashion sense.

As for what the Summoner should or shouldn't be. Historically the Summoners in the Final Fantasy Series were either primarily White Mages (although there was one instance of it being a Black Mage) with the additional ability to summon monsters to aid them in battle, or the summoning ability was an ability that all characters had access to regardless of what their primary occupation is. I mean Cloud Strife and Squall Leonheart both had the ability to summon Bahamut to their aid, but they were both primarily sword-wielding bad asses, not summoners.

Point is, the concept of a "Dedicated Summoner" class is something that is relatively new within the Final Fantasy Franchise. You only really see it's presence in Final Fantasy XI and Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn, and in the case of the former people generally prefer the Summoner to be a back-up healer instead of being a dedicated Summoner. In fact it is only in the case of Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn that the role of the Summoner is so well defined that it actually has a specific job to do in the party instead of being relegated to doing something it wasn't intended to do.

[Dwill]

Snip

It's Akiza you're replying to so it should come as no surprise that logic is absent and ignorance is aplenty.

[Akiza]

ROFLMAO. Snip .

In an MMORPG the class and role has to agree with each other otherwise the presentation falls apart. Generally people prefer a "Dedicated Summoner" (role centered around Pets) instead of the Summoner as a back-up healer since they'll be nerfed White Mages and a crippled healer since all their traits go to enhanced pets and damage buffs. Most MMORPG's developer have the Summoner in a "Dedicated Pet Role" with a flashy pet since it's easier to implement the developers vision for how the class is intended to be played. I'm pretty sure that the Final Fantasy XIV developer isn't happy how the Summoner has turned out since we ended being Garuda Master's.

[ClaireTagg]

A few cool suggestions on how the to make the Smn more fun to play and more true to their name:

Replace all Dot abilities with "Summon Spells"
-These "summon spells" can either have cast times or be instant casts, just like the Dots they are replacing.
-"summon spells" will summon a entity/monster from the FF universe and will deal instant burst damage as well as apply a dot effect. Of course the combined damage of the initial damage+ dot will be equal to the total damage of the old Dot spell that they replace.
-the entity summoned by this spell is non-controllable and is basically a spell effect.
-example: Instant cast bio deals 800 damage over 17 seconds. The new "summon spell" that replaces this will deal 350 damage instantly, and an additional 450 over 17 seconds.
-other "summon spells" could summon an entity which only applies a dot, with no initial damage.
-This should make summoners more true to their name while keeping with their Dot play style

[ClaireTagg]

Remove Ruin I/II and the spam associated with it
-Remove Ruin I and replace it with Ruin II.
-Ruin II should cost a tiny bit more more mp and have a cast time.
-Ruin I should be replaced with a skill that commands your pet to do an attack. Instant Cast. No cool-down.
-Once the command is activated, the pet will cast the ability regardless of what it's doing.
-Doing the command will not cancel any attack the pet currently doing/casting.
-the pet can do the command attack and it's own ability at the same time (i know, possible animation clipping problems)
-Ifrit Eggi: Blazing Tackle - instantly charges to the target within X range dealing X damage.
-Garu Egi: Windlash - instantly applies a dot to the target which stacks up to 3 times on the same target, deals X damage over 9 seconds. Reapplying the effect does not reset the time remaining on the Dot.
-Titan Egi: Earthen Uproar - instantly taunt (X range) the target and deal X damage(melee range).