Is this the road they will continue to take with items?

[Taban]

Hi Welsper,

No, I wasn't stating my preference for a fixed time "after acquiring an item," I was pointing out to Taban the claim that "6 months" being plenty of time w/ a piece of gear wasn't true at all for many people; many players don't have a "new shiny" from the day of the patch release -> say, 5 - 6 months (next iLevel Patch Bump).

Ultimately, I can only speak for myself (and many of my JP and NA friends) in saying that the current pace of gear inflation is too accelerated for our tastes.

So much work is wasted (fights / dungeons being outdated so quickly), or if something gets to be too RNG-reliant (e.g., certain HA piece not dropping), I'm hearing more and more comments (and I feel the same way), that, "Meh, doesn't matter. Next (big) patch will invalidate the gear anyways. Whatever."

The general feeling of detachment from the rewards you're getting because of how fast Item Level / Vertical Progression is going isn't something I like in FF XIV at all.

I hope they change this.

They can't account for your personal RNG when creating a release schedule. It could take me 5 years to see a pair of High Allagan Gloves drop from Turn 7 (odds are it won't, but it could). That doesn't mean they should delay releasing upgrades. Those same players who don't have the shiny new item from the day of the patch release probably won't have the shiny new upgrade on the day of the next patch release 6 months later. How long do you want gear to stagnate before you're comfortable that you've had yours long enough?

[Taban]

Except you forgot to mention that 90% of the fanbase left the game once abby was introduced, SE was forced to merge servers to cut costs, and released an expansion in a desperate attempt to get them back. Also, if you unsub, you can't post on the game's forums, which is why there was no complaints.

Where are you getting your subscription numbers? =p I haven't been able to find them. Also was this 90% of the 10% remaining after 90% of the active players were all banned in the salvage bans? Or did 90% quit first, and then 90% of that remaining 10% were all banned?

[Gazille]

Are you crazy? I hate keeping the same gear, Thats why I welcome expansions so I can finally replace the same old boring stuff I had to look at.

[Kiara]

They can't account for your personal RNG when creating a release schedule. It could take me 5 years to see a pair of High Allagan Gloves drop from Turn 7 (odds are it won't, but it could). That doesn't mean they should delay releasing upgrades. Those same players who don't have the shiny new item from the day of the patch release probably won't have the shiny new upgrade on the day of the next patch release 6 months later. How long do you want gear to stagnate before you're comfortable that you've had yours long enough?

Hi Taban,

You seem to be going to black & white extremes here. First, it was in regards to the idea that it was a full "6 months," which is simply not true. Perhaps for the freak RNG 0.001% / one player that beat the newest end game raid on Day 1, and won their drop, but realistically the Dev Team can estimate and see past data that it'll probably be a few weeks / 1st month before a small group starts getting a drop here or there.

They also have access to their Drop Rate and metrics. They know if there's only a 1:12 chance for something to drop, and factoring in time / clears, etc. what the distribution of rewards is going to be like over time.

Lastly, no one's advocating for your extreme "let gear stagnate" stance. Those of us that are asking for *some* (partial) Horizontal Progression are essentially asking for similar things: We WANT NEW GEAR also. It's just a different angle to approach it.

A quick example: *IF* Stats mattered more, and they made a discernible difference, you could easily have multiple builds for -

(All the same "Item Level")

* Tank VIT Build - Blood Tanking, Highest HP Pool, etc.
* Tank STR Build - Strength that actually made a real difference in Block Damage Reduction, and Damage #'s (which means more Enmity / more Offensive Tank).
* Tank DEX Build - Dexterity that really mattered, that affected Parry Rate, Block Rate and/or Evasion Rate.
* Gear that had "Increased Enmity"
* Gear that had "Enhances Rampart" (making Rampart AOE Shield Buff for anyone in range).
* Maybe a Rare Crafted Set (w/ Very Rare Dungeon Drop Mats) that allowed slotting of Counterattack Materia.

Etc.

Instead with Vertical Progression and Limited Stats that really matter, Yoshi P has painted himself into a corner. He has no choice but to keep increasing Item Level and increase the same boring limited Stats every few months, because there are NO other venues / no other possible meaningful gear.

Horizontal Progression (or even Partial Horizontal Progression) still gives you New Gear and it *could* come out at the same pace as now ("6 months" as you say), except that your current max level set isn't completely eradicated.

[Exstal]

In short, bring back the illusion of choice.

Just say that next time.

[Zumi]

Except you forgot to mention that 90% of the fanbase left the game once abby was introduced, SE was forced to merge servers to cut costs, and released an expansion in a desperate attempt to get them back. Also, if you unsub, you can't post on the game's forums, which is why there was no complaints.

This is wrong. A ton of people came back to play FFXI when abyssea came out in my LS because it was new and finally could level past 75. Server merges happened way before abyssea came out because people stopped playing the game cause there was no new endgame content for about 2 years.

[HeroSamson]

Which road do SE take their items to?

Is this a road that they drop items off to cause I don't see items out on the roads in FFXIV so what road do you speak of?

[YuriRamona]

SE makes gear progression horizontal and grinding: players complain about taking too long to see improvements and higher-end content too inaccessible.

SE makes gear progression vertical and volatile: players complain about content being outdated too quickly and old gear handed out too easily.

SE really can't win with you people.

This game has some of easiest vertical progression out there (for a modern, subscription MMO). You can comfortably reach level 50 within a week and get i90 at the same time.

Despite the game constantly trying to shove gear and bonuses down your pants, there are still gigantic portions of the population who still haven't cleared Hard Mode primals and the first five turns of Coil (which have been released for a year).

The last thing we want to do is take away Easy Mode features like Hunts and Logs from people who are permanently on the struggle bus (especially if they're new to the game, where the population still at their progress gets thinner and thinner every day).

Do you really want to play a game where you're working towards the same goal for years and years? Jump in a time machine and play FFXI...

[Tupsi]

This is wrong. A ton of people came back to play FFXI when abyssea came out in my LS because it was new and finally could level past 75. Server merges happened way before abyssea came out because people stopped playing the game cause there was no new endgame content for about 2 years.

Let's not kid ourselves - More people left compared to more came back. You did however see more newer players coming in as they were taking advantage of the dual sub discount for XIV/XI eventually offered.

So you're not exactly correct either. Server mergings happened before, during and after Abyssea as well, but she was more correct in stating after Abyssea they did have a merger because of the dropped number, which included the infamous Titan and Phoenix merging.

As for no new end-game - Abyssea was 2009-2010, WotG end-game, WoE and Voidwatch was introduced just before and during that time span. Prior to that was the conclusion of ToAU's end game.

[Zumi]

As for no new end-game - Abyssea was 2009-2010, WotG end-game, WoE and Voidwatch was introduced just before and during that time span. Prior to that was the conclusion of ToAU's end game.

Voidwatch was after Abyssea it offered side grades and some upgrades to abyssea gear at 1% drop rates. WoE was before and after. There were some 75 WoE zones and there were several after Abessa that was for lv90

FFXI progression was Abyssea > Voidwatch => Legion > Seekers Expansion (delve, wildskeepers, skermish)