Any way to play Summoner AND Scholar without hindering your attribute points?

[Exstal]

Except with a parser, a geared and skilled Arcanist could put 30 points in STR and play SMN/SCH without anyone noticing.

Since the combat log doesn't show much of what SMN/SCH damage type does, I would agree with this.

Once they allow us to actually SEE what's going on, then there will be problems.

[Saccharin]

The best solution would be to bind points to the job and class just like action bars operate independently. I find it strange that this wasn't though of when they made a two role class. For me jobs also need to offer job traits that augment base class spells to make them fell different for each job rather than the same no matter what job crystal you use.

Edit: that being said, points give no real choice currently anyway. Have secondary stats instead selectable. Low on accuracy you can add some to a certain cap. Same with determination. Piety should also remain as an option. I guess make it similar choice-wise as novus.

They should just give scholar a line of INT gear and bada-boom, problem fixed (bandaged). I don't know why Square creates these problems for itself. SMN and Scholar sharing the same base class. Maintaining a tank, healer and dps trinity so there is no chance of seeing RDM. Why Square, why?

That would indeed fix it but then it means that healers would compete with damage casters for gear and it also means that damage casters could also work as reasonable healers too. If you look at how black mage works you could have a healer that NEVER runs out of mana if a blizzard spell was used often. It's just psychic but unlimited uses?

[Brianmj]

That would indeed fix it but then it means that healers would compete with damage casters for gear and it also means that damage casters could also work as reasonable healers too. If you look at how black mage works you could have a healer that NEVER runs out of mana if a blizzard spell was used often. It's just psychic but unlimited uses?

heh, you're really stretching "reasonable" when it comes to BLM/SMN healing potential. I can spam Physick as a SMN without any mp loss, which has the same potency as cure. BLM and SMN don't get access to cleric stance, so my 400 hp cures won't be saving any party in endgame content. I already have to compete with BLMs for gear; adding another job to the INT line won't make any noticeable difference.

[Malusion]

heh, you're really stretching "reasonable" when it comes to BLM/SMN healing potential. I can spam Physick as a SMN without any mp loss, which has the same potency as cure. BLM and SMN don't get access to cleric stance, so my 400 hp cures won't be saving any party in endgame content. I already have to compete with BLMs for gear; adding another job to the INT line won't make any noticeable difference.

If I've understood you right from that, you mean that in this solution SCH should use int gear and heal in cleric stance? That leads to some other issues, some easier to deal with than others.

First there's that cleric stance has a flat healing done reduction on it, but in this scenario that could just be removed, as that's there to prevent healers gearing int, and you're proposing a scenario where scholar is meant to. Then there's that Cleric Stance is a conjurer skill, not an arcanist one. Having a job literally -need- a cross classing skill active to do their job seems to go against their design philosophy, even though most cross class abilities are pretty much set in stone, and some are considered absolute must haves, there's nothing that just makes you completely unable to do your job without it. Example for this would be swiftcast, you're not gonna see anyone choose anything else over it, but you could still technically live without it. Though all scholars have access to cleric stance, since you need conjurer high enough to unlock it, so I don't see that as a big issue either.

Really the biggest problem with it all would be in gear competition. Either you have 3 jobs that compete for int gear, and 1 job having mind gear all to itself, which messes up the loot balance entirely, or you have 4 jobs going for int gear, and you just get rid of mind gear and increase the rate of which it drops, having everyone heal in cleric stance.

So really, its not that simple a solution. ^^

[Kaeda_Valentyne]

Couldn't you just put all your points in INT for the SMN, than use cleric stance from CNJ to swap them when your a SCH?

It would kind of be the opposite of the use for CNJ, instead of using it to be better at DPS for CNJ you would use it to be better at healing as a SCH.

Does this make since or am I missing something obvious. I haven't played much on either.

Edit: Your right ispano I missed that it effected the % of healing and damage as well as the INT / MND swap.
Maybe they should look into a stance for SMN / SCH that only swaps the INT / MND.

[ispano]

Couldn't you just put all your points in INT for the SMN, than use cleric stance from CNJ to swap them when your a SCH?

It would kind of be the opposite of the use for CNJ, instead of using it to be better at DPS for CNJ you would use it to be better at healing as a SCH.

Does this make since or am I missing something obvious. I haven't played much on either.

No, it doesn't. Because Cleric Stance also reduces your healing in addition to swapping the stats. And it swaps ALL of the stat, meaning you'd have to have a full int set, and even then with Cleric on you'd heal for less than if you had straight mind.

[DishSoap]

Then there's that Cleric Stance is a conjurer skill, not an arcanist one. Having a job literally -need- a cross classing skill active to do their job seems to go against their design philosophy, even though most cross class abilities are pretty much set in stone, and some are considered absolute must haves, there's nothing that just makes you completely unable to do your job without it.

What about Provoke? Not that I don't agree with your points though.

[Midori_Nabooru]

I have all my points in mind, because I main whm/sch. I can dps just fine on my smn in T5 and Ex primals. Would I take my smn into Second Coil, probably not. Sch there's probably less of a need for all the mind because Lustrate is just so good. You just have to choose what you would play *most* of the time and work from there.

[Malusion]

What about Provoke? Not that I don't agree with your points though.

Thats another good example, probably an even better one than Swiftcast, it slipped my mind when I wrote that post. While it would be an extremely arduous task to balance out, you could do old school tank swapping with balancing out to keep similar threat levels and manually dropping it to swap, though. Before I knew about provoke I was actually kind of hoping that was how you did it in this game, heh. I'd argue a scholar with no mind could in no way perform their job, regardless of coordination. At best, they'd just be able to be carried by the other healer.

[DefendPopPunk]

Short answer: no
Long answer: nope