[Pole] Do you want to see the summoner class reworked?

[EdenArchangel]

Yes, the current summoner as is should just be name-changed to warlock and replace the egis with voidsent "minions" that have even more DoTs

Equipping the new summoner job crystal should change Bio, Bio II, Miasma etc. to a different, Egi-specific ability

Won't ever happen but... meh

[Dwill]

I would say yes.

As far as pet classes go, it's not a complete failure, but compared to Summoners in single player FFs as well as other pet classes it's in the back of the class.

At the very least, I think they should strongly boost the power of the Enkindle abilities to give it more of the "Summon Limit Break" feel. Would 500-600 Potency be too overpowered? I honestly don't feel like it would be, it has a 5 minute cooldown as it is so it's not like it can be abused that much.

From a gameplay standpoint as a DPS it's still good, there's nothing offensive about it, it just scratches the surface of what a summoning class could be. Did I mention it wasn't as good as the single player FF incarnations (or WoW's Warlock)?

Here's the thing that a lot of people seems to not get, which is obviously a lot of people in this thread with all the posts about "Warlock wanna-be posts, no summoner in this game". Summoners in the Final Fantasy universe differs from game to game. This game to the approach of Rydia in FFIV, a summoner well versed in black magic but with a minimum amount of knowledge of White Magic but with a permanent pet with us.

Summoners in the other games are either WHM with on demand bursts or gimpy healers with a pet doing everything for them. Yeah, sounds like a wonderful idea to have in this

People really have no ideas about the implications of a total rework or even what they really want in the first place, seeing the amount of iterations of summoners across the Final Fantasy universe. But they do say ignorance is bliss.

[Xaeth]

Yes! I don't think that the current summoner is giving enough focus on the pets.

[Havenchild]

Read through most of this thread. Some opinions:

1) People asking summoners for a DPS increase. Because being third place to melee classes only in single target damage is not good enough. *eye roll*
2) The egis could look slightly better but no I don't agree on something much bigger because it would be obscuring other details on the field for other people. Something more akin to resemblance would be ideal.
3) People asking for cast times to be removed from Bio 2 and Miasma. May actually hurt the class overall and lower DPS.
4) People saying managing pet skills is too difficult. I don't even know where to start with this one.

5) People asking for more use of Ifrit or titan, I'm half and half on this. Titan in itself is a paradox, because of the way the trinity party setup is. A role of a tank, isn't useful if there are tanks. Titan should in no way ever be as powerful as a paladin or warrior nor should it be comparably close in building enmity. An egi to invalidate actual classes in itself, SE doesn't support either. (EX: Ramuh EX). Ifrit can be reworked to some extent. However, the only thing that would happen is likely his DPS increasing? Then that being weighed against Contagion from Garuda.

Is it a Summoner? From what most seem to be comparing it too on the FF universe, there's not much understanding of what summons have been in many of the FF games.

Summons and Summoners have been ever changing through the FF universe, from being the dominate healer role, (Yuna) , to primarily just summoning (Tactics), to outright not even direct affiliation with a "class" but just usable casts. (FFXII, FFVII, FFVIII etcetc). This game has a new take on it, it's really that simple.

The class is better now, then half the suggestions being stated in this thread as most would in fact hurt the class.

So: No, it doesn't need a complete rework, but a slight changes to a few skills, like Bane (more range) or some of the pet skills like, Ifrit's reflect skill (probably the most useless skill) or really swapping out some pet skills in general that make interaction more beneficial.

[lordparanoia]

I would like:
-blizzard II to be removed from the cross class abilities. We really don't need it : we already have tri disaster to bind.
- give us manaward: black mage Can protect themselves while summoners can't.
- improve tridisaster
- remove the limit of 3 mobs affected by bane.


And of course smn is no more the best dps, now blm is op in single and multi target. This is wrong. We need a smn rebalance.

[Estevo]

Read through most of this thread. Some opinions:

Is it a Summoner? From what most seem to be comparing it too on the FF universe, there's not much understanding of what summons have been in many of the FF games.

Summons and Summoners have been ever changing through the FF universe, from being the dominate healer role, (Yuna) , to primarily just summoning (Tactics), to outright not even direct affiliation with a "class" but just usable casts. (FFXII, FFVII, FFVIII etcetc). This game has a new take on it, it's really that simple.

To be honest, I don't really mind the fact that we use dots spells and such, that doesn't affect anything really, what does affect the Job to me is that the warlock aspect is about 75% of the job, which I think is mostly because of the fact that jobs aren't very prominent in your character build right now, with such few skills attained, it's mostly the class abilities. As the one and only pet dps job, especially the summoner, the Egis and other pets should make up at least 40-50% of our dps and mechanics, it's kind of lackluster lore-wise to just bring out the pet and then let it do it's thing, which is not much most of the time, the case should be that we put our heart and soul into summoning those things, we should be able to do something like boost them in power in exchange for our own life force (hp etc.) Make them important, make them the power behind the summoner!

[yowatta]

no, just reskin to egis to the primals, and problem solved.

[Dwill]

I would like:
-blizzard II to be removed from the cross class abilities. We really don't need it : we already have tri disaster to bind.
- give us manaward: black mage Can protect themselves while summoners can't.
- improve tridisaster
- remove the limit of 3 mobs affected by bane.


And of course smn is no more the best dps, now blm is op in single and multi target. This is wrong. We need a smn rebalance.

First off, Blizzard II is not used for its bind put for its damage potency in an AoE situation when we have DoTs/Shadowflare rolling. It is much more effective that the disaster of a spell that Tri-Disaster is (High mana cost, ridiculously damage output).

Secondly, removing the Bane target limit would be much too broken. Contagion'ed full duration dots (Bio II (525), Bio (440) and Miasma(475) at full duration each would be approximately 1405 potency (Including one tick of Bio II before Bane'ing). That's equal to 3 Flares done under Astral Fire III, which is impossible to do unless they pop a Mega-Ether and use Convert which has a 3 minutes cooldown while we rely solely on having Aetherflow stacks and having Contagion up. That's also excluding the fact that there is the possibility of Shadow Flare running, Miasma II that is going to run, pet AoE and Blizzard II spam in between.

By the way, Black Mage and Summoners are even on single target damage. Black Mage bursts harder, Summoners have much better utility and mobility. For AoE, Black Mages are better but Summoners' AoE is nothing to laugh at either, if done correctly. And honestly, AoE means next to nothing in raids, it'll just help you shave off 2-3 minutes in your dungeons speed runs and trash pulls in ST.

I wonder if you people ever think of the suggestions you propose or you just think this is awesome and should be done but don't even bother looking how it would affect balance as a whole.

To be honest, I don't really mind the fact that we use dots spells and such, that doesn't affect anything really, what does affect the Job to me is that the warlock aspect is about 75% of the job, which I think is mostly because of the fact that jobs aren't very prominent in your character build right now, with such few skills attained, it's mostly the class abilities. As the one and only pet dps job,especially the summoner, the Egis and other pets should make up at least 40-50% of our dps and mechanics, it's kind of lackluster lore-wise to just bring out the pet and then let it do it's thing, which is not much most of the time, the case should be that we put our heart and soul into summoning those things, we should be able to do something like boost them in power in exchange for our own life force (hp etc.) Make them important, make them the power behind the summoner!

The pet is already between 25-30% of our damage. Do you understand the implications of having the pet do half of our damage ?

[DistraughtKoala]

If I thought the whiners on here wold ruin the job I most enjoy I would be worried, but since it's not going to happen I can laugh at all of the stupid ideas here. Keep the qq'ing coming.

[Alistaire]

I would like:
-blizzard II to be removed from the cross class abilities. We really don't need it : we already have tri disaster to bind.
- give us manaward: black mage Can protect themselves while summoners can't.
- improve tridisaster
- remove the limit of 3 mobs affected by bane.


And of course smn is no more the best dps, now blm is op in single and multi target. This is wrong. We need a smn rebalance.

Bliz 2 is great in dungeons, any time there's more than 1 mob up and you'd ruin, bliz 2 instead. A retooling of tri-disaster would be nice though.

If the bane limit were utterly removed there would be no more blms in pf for dungeon runs.

If I thought the whiners on here wold ruin the job I most enjoy I would be worried, but since it's not going to happen I can laugh at all of the stupid ideas here. Keep the qq'ing coming.

Nice.