Ishgard' s archbisschop

[Rocl]

Guillaime (the false Inquisitor) and his Temple Knight conspirator (name I can't remember, but you fight him at Francel's trial and he summons a Wyvern) are two I'd argue display tempered behaviour and unlikely to be victims of torture.

[Saikou]

What does Marcellus Wallace look like!? No, let's try that again...


What does a "normal" dravanian beastman look like and what innate abilities do the rank and file have? It could be that the powers our false Inquisitor and false Templar displayed are not uncommon abilities among the Dravanian people. Or their shape-shifting power is primal related. That's pretty much our two options.

I'd like to see what a Dravanian looks like, and I'm hoping it's not just, like, intelligent Thustaevis or other dragon type mobs that we see in Coerthas. There is just so much we do not know about the Dravanian hordes, their kings, and what primal(s) they might worship. Finding out what the Bahamut and Twintania connections to the Dravanians would be fun.

[Xmbei]

Considering dragons and the keeper Midgardsormr were protecting the seal of the primals until the empire broke it. I think there is definately more to and possibly good to do with the dragons?

[Saikou]

Because those hatreds are so old, if we need to team up with the Dravanians for any reason whatsoever, there will be friction with Ishgard. And I believe this is precisely what they are going to do, since it makes for a more interesting story. The blood of millions of Ishgardians and Sharlayans is on their hands, however...

And what would make us team up with dragons? Let me lay a guess that it will be something more powerful than Bahamut.

[axemtitanium]

So you're assuming that hundu beastmen once found halone and named her Shiva?

I'd like to shoot some holes in this theory:

* Some Primals such as Odin and Leviathan have no correlating member of the 12
* The elements don't match the corresponding of the 12 for most of them
Im sure there are other holrs but those are what comes to mind for me.

I never said every primal is a member of The Twelve in disguise (or vice versa). Shiva has been stated to be different/special compared to other primals a number of times. This one (and I'd nominate Ramuh as well in this category) seems to be more strategic and cunning in her operations.

[Myranda]

One theory proposed by another in my FC is that Shiva does actually lord over the dragons, and hasn't tempered Ishgard, but has still manipulated them into their continuous Holy War to feed off the aether released by the massive loss of life from both sides. In this way, Ishgardians would have no reason to exhibit fanatical devotion to her by name, and in a way the dragons sort of do (I don't think we've encountered an actual dragon talking yet? Though there is the heretic "inspector", so I'm not sure where to go with that).

I could see several of these scenarios tossed out there as plausible and can't really choose one as a clear frontrunner in my mind, but I do think it's pretty obvious now at least that Shiva and Ishgard's stories intersect each other in some way, and that Shiva is most likely very subtle and underhanded in her dealings compared to the brash in-your-face personalities of Garuda and Ifrit.

[Morningstar1337]

...and that Shiva is most likely very subtle and underhanded in her dealings compared to the brash in-your-face personalities of Garuda and Ifrit.

I think Shiva would be the most sociopathic of the Primals. Probably (and will likely think of herself as) closer to one Vincent Cheung's interpretation of the Abrahamic God is then her namesake (or you know, more common interpretations of God. The fact that this links to Fundies Say The Darndest Things tells a lot about this guy.)

And to prove her sociopathy there will be an area full of suspicious ice statues that bear an uncanny resebalence to the five races and dragons. And then to hammer it home she'll threaten to freeze the scions in this manner (ala Frozen)

How this related to the other primals. Well She'll likely be a literal cheating bastard, as opposed to Ifrit and Garuda's "fair" play. And As another indicator of her sociopathy, she'll likely think compassion and empathy would be weakness (and cite Titan's and Ramuh's defeats as examples). Her overall personaly will be cold; stoic, shrewd and devoid of all empahy and sympathy to others, not even her own subject would be safe from her wrath.

[Kyan]

Guillaime (the false Inquisitor) and his Temple Knight conspirator (name I can't remember, but you fight him at Francel's trial and he summons a Wyvern) are two I'd argue display tempered behaviour and unlikely to be victims of torture.

I'd have to rewatch that dialogue again, but I would agree. In the quote I was referring to though, Catapult and Enkidoh were talking about the prisoners in the cells located in Coerthas who are quite broken people.

[A_Magical_Unicorn_Rider]

Finding out what the Bahamut and Twintania connections to the Dravanians would be fun.

AFAIK, Twin has nothing to do with the Dravanians. It's implied that she and her ilk are remnants of Merisidia (can't be arsed to remember how that's spelled), which is a separate continent to the south, iirc.

[Enkidoh]

What does Marcellus Wallace look like!? No, let's try that again...


What does a "normal" dravanian beastman look like and what innate abilities do the rank and file have? It could be that the powers our false Inquisitor and false Templar displayed are not uncommon abilities among the Dravanian people. Or their shape-shifting power is primal related. That's pretty much our two options.

I'd like to see what a Dravanian looks like, and I'm hoping it's not just, like, intelligent Thustaevis or other dragon type mobs that we see in Coerthas. There is just so much we do not know about the Dravanian hordes, their kings, and what primal(s) they might worship. Finding out what the Bahamut and Twintania connections to the Dravanians would be fun.

The game clearly states the Dravanian Horde are the thustaevises - they're like their rank and file grunts, where as the true dragons like Svara and Nidhogg are the 'aristocracy', the leaders of the Horde. Thus this makes the Dravanians somewhat unique amongst the other beastmen tribes - more bestial and less like men. But the actual dragons like Nidhogg are shown to be intelligent, and even capable of communication (such as during the DRG quests).

To me at least, I think that the Dravanians are different to other beastmen in that the actual dragons of their tribe are capable of directly corrupting men (such as shown during the DRG quests) without the presence of a Primal, which probably explains how they've been creating heretics without any apparent Primal summoning going on. That would also pour, excuse the pun, hot water on the whole 'Shiva is the Primal of the dragons' theory, but it does go someway to explaining how the dragons have been brainwashing for so long without a Primal's influence.