I think it is time to admit the obvious - Echo is an insult to the average gamer.

[Dude]

The ECHO is important for PUG groups. I still play with groups who cant clear AK on roulette. I don't think this game is overly friendly to new MMO players and the ECHO helps compensate for them.

[Kimikryo]

The ECHO is important for PUG groups. I still play with groups who cant clear AK on roulette. I don't think this game is overly friendly to new MMO players and the ECHO helps compensate for them.

Wait, there is Echo in AK?
Dude, I don't think so.

But yes, it IS a blessing for PUGs. And .... some groups still manage to fail t2 with 15% Echo *cringing commences*

[Taruranto]

What's the point of gating new content behind old content? Just so the elite can wave their epeen even more? Why do you care so much about other people clearing something you probably never do nowadays? If you want a Dark Souls type of game go play Dark Souls.

What's the point of doing new content when you can't even finish the old one? So the noobs can ruin the fun for those who legitimately finished it with their low skill? Why do you care so much about new content when you can't even finish the old one overgeared? If you can't beat Garuda and Twintania in iLevel100 you think you'll have a shoot at T6 and Levi? If you want WoW, go play WoW.

[Aushi]

I don't see Echo as an insult. I see it as a crutch. I've been in random groups for fights that aren't even hard and literally get twitchy eyes when I see "Oh! Guys! Let's die a lot so we get the Echo!" or "Don't worry about dying guys, you don't need to learn the fight, if we die a bunch it helps us cuz we can get the Echo."

I understand the advantages of Echo. When you don't have time to make a lot of friends and can only depend on the DF for fights, you risk getting people who do not know the fight, who are under geared for the fight, etc, and the Echo allows you to move on with the content you otherwise would have been stuck at because of bad luck with other people.

BUT

When people literally DEPEND on it, it gets annoying as heck. Specially when you get threatened to get kicked for not agreeing to wait for the Echo and just try to pass it without it...

[Kallera]

What's the point of doing new content when you can't even finish the old one? So the noobs can ruin the fun for those who legitimately finished it with their low skill? Why do you care so much about new content when you can't even finish the old one overgeared? If you can't beat Garuda and Twintania in iLevel100 you think you'll have a shoot at T6 and Levi? If you want WoW, go play WoW.

This attitude is what makes players leave the game. You really don't want this. Players are not a doormat for this sort of behavior. At some point they really will take up the retort. Maybe not for WoW, but EQN, or other games not in the genre.

Because you pride yourself on hitting buttons.

[NaliaBrown]

What's the point of doing new content when you can't even finish the old one? So the noobs can ruin the fun for those who legitimately finished it with their low skill? Why do you care so much about new content when you can't even finish the old one overgeared? If you can't beat Garuda and Twintania in iLevel100 you think you'll have a shoot at T6 and Levi? If you want WoW, go play WoW.

I am still struggling with Twintania. I'm not saying I need more echo or anything (I think we are close to beating it - we got closer last night than ever before), but I don't think it should be taken away, either. Content like 1st Coil is old content now, dropping old gear. But I really want to beat it so I can get more of the story. Then I want to start doing 2nd Coil because the story will continue. That's why, even with my low skill level, I want to get past this content. For the story. Everyone who's good is already working on 2nd Coil. That's good for them. By the time I'm getting stuff from 2nd Coil, the next level will probably be out (I expect it will take some time for my group to pass T6, based on how long T5 has taken us) and the good, elite players will already be beyond 2nd Coil gear.

[HeroSamson]

I agree. Whenever I join titan hm to pass the time and people fail, they see this buff and think hurrah! leet buffs! Then when they finally win with 30-50% echo they are like:" We did it guys!". (While still dead on the floor mind you.)

I thought I was the only one that actually saw the echo notification as an insult telling you you suck and need the game to help you.

Are you going to help them? Because from what I have seen people say are "why should I take my time out to help someone else" Why even complain about the buff when you already did the fight.

When people have probably been struggling for months, you think they shouldn't enjoy the full content or be stuck in one place forever?

[Nestama]

Ive seen alot of players like you, when the echoe buff went live..
All of them were the players, that failed the most in the group.

Good thing I spam the fight because it's fun and therefore know exactly what to do? Only time we wiped at all on that fight was because the SMN didn't control their pet (was attacking the King, which got him to use Memento Moogle way too soon).

Also, I highly doubt my ilvl90 BLM/SCH is holding anyone back whenever I remove the Echo.

[Kuwagami]

Also, I highly doubt my ilvl90 BLM/SCH is holding anyone back whenever I remove the Echo.

wether or not you do, using your ilevel as an argument is showing that you don't know what it is. a i100 can be more of an hindrance than a i80 sometimes

don't take me wrong, was just saying that. No more, no less.

Personnal skill isn't related to ilevel (except if you are above i100, maybe)

[RickXRolled]

Are you going to help them? Because from what I have seen people say are "why should I take my time out to help someone else" Why even complain about the buff when you already did the fight.

When people have probably been struggling for months, you think they shouldn't enjoy the full content or be stuck in one place forever?

I do titan 3-8 times a day to pass the time. 95% of the time I complete them, whether it' s with or without echo depends on the rest. The amount of people I' ve carried as the only living dps or the only healer is ridiculously high.
If I see someone actually trying and improving I will keep going for their sake. if I see people die in I90+ and not improve I will still try to finish the fight but I won' t really care if we win or not.

I' ve been doing this since November, back then I did it by joining shout/pf once it was introduced. Now I just quee for it in the DF.