Exaltation and doubts concerning Rogue/Ninja

[Radacci]

They mentioned Ninjas using Mudras (hand seals) you combine them in different orders, to cause different effects. if you dont combine them in the right order, nothing happens.
So there's 4-5 different seals, that you could make quite a lot of different effects with (potentially) So you dont really need lots of skill slots.
Also they said they will increase lv cap, when they add new jobs...so maybe we'll get lv60-75. in which case each job would get 5 more job skills, 6 class skills, and passive/traits.

Also...please stop using XI as model....
Most of the Jobs that were in XI, that are in XIV, work differently, so will Ninja.

[Gormogon]

To me Rogue and Thief are literally the same thing.

If anything the second job should be Sky Pirate.

Sky Pirate: Wields a dagger and pistol.
lvl 3 limit break. Don't listen to Ondores lies.

[DoubleT]

having doubts over a bunch of speculation huh? ok....

an as far as the 17/5 ability ratio an 2 jobs coming from 1 class, that has already been discussed to death. All they have to do is change how some abilities work for the other job. I mean look at Sch an Smn. Those 5 abilites were enough to make the jobs stand apart. For example. Let's say they make Drk come out of Pld. All they have to do is give him a buff like Shield Oath, that instead of generating aggro, turns his aggro abilites into higher damage abilites so he doesnt generate threat and deals better dps. Granted this is all speculation too, but to say that the company cant design 2 jobs for every class because of the limiting 17/5 ability ratios, is pretty dumb, as they have already proven that they CAN do it.

[Rubieus]

But Dragoons have three jumps. Jump, Spineshatter Dive and Dragonfire Dive.

Dragoon has 1 Jump ability with a cooldown of 40s. The other two abilities are ... a travesty. Jump should be a staple, Or it's not dragoon. It's a wannabe dragoon.

[Monsalvato]

but to say that the company cant design 2 jobs for every class because of the limiting 17/5 ability ratios

Hope you're quoting someone else because this is totally not what I said.

SMN and SCH do indeed feel very different, but that's because:
1) They are different roles: DPS and Healer
2) They are currently (NIN to be the next one?) exception to the 17+5 rule. Thanks to pet actions, the difference among them is far greater than "just" 5 actions.

If we exclude the exceptions of Pet actions and Mudra (hope we're gonna see more of these creative solutions, altough it makes you think: why do they have circumvein a limit they created themselves when they could just delete such limit?), situation would be quite different for another class.
It would be hard If you were to create a second job of the same role for one class, and differentiating them with only 5 actions (REALLY 5 now).
Possible? Yes.
Realistically very hard? Alas, yes.

[Monsalvato]

Also maybe I completely went of track and if it's the case I apologize, but I don't get your attitude with your post.
It seems you came here with the attitude off "Pffff kids, allow me to shut your mouth up by pouring my wisdom on you annoying kids".
Do you want to discuss? Then come here, voice your opinions and provide ways to support them and try to confront yourself with other users on equal ground.

The "fun" of a forum should be confronting yourself. The goal here is talking, discussing, and maybe changing your mind after finding out perspectives you missed.
Sometimes for some people it seems the goal instead is proving who's wrong and who's right and coming out victor of some sort of "war" they see everywhere.

This should be a place for discussion, suppositions and opinions exchange, not a battleground... just my two cents of course.

[abzoluut]

I think it's rather silly, to be honest. I mean, because of this system they randomly had to give a SONG to ARCHER, since they can't fit it in the 5 from the Bard job (which, let's face it, is forced as it is.. archer -> bard? WTF were you smoking SE?).

Exactly. I hope we will get an honest answer some day, I doubt it though.

All is good when they add 2nd jobs to our classes with RNG coming from archer.

[Radacci]

snip

Neither SMN nor SCH, changes the way that ACN skills work.
I'm quite sure DRK wouldnt get a skill that convert halone, to damage...cause it's already 260 potency. They might get another skill that combos off Riot blade instead, or 2 new skills for a new combo (you know war has 3 combo finishers.)
Also, swords have same atk as spears; PLD only does less damage than DRG, because PLD get less damage/str, than DRG, so they only need to increase the amount of damage that DRK get/str. Then GLD got fight or flight also, for +30% damage.
The problem with GLD->DRK, is that GLD has to much defensive buffs, which would make a DD DRK, to OP. So it'd be better if they made LNC->DRK instead, giving it B4B, Life Surge, Dread Spike, etc. That way they could make it a parry based leech tank, that convert some of the incoming damage, to HP instead (Though that already sounds a bit like what WAR, is currently doing)

[Monsalvato]

Exactly. I hope we will get an honest answer some day, I doubt it though.

We already have the honest answer, I mean, we already know the "truth" that they'll never say.
They made Archer > Bard because it was more unique and original.
At the same time they couldn't make it into an hybrid or supporter class because:
1) They needed a ranged physical DPS
2) The current system has a very strict implementation of the trinity system (tank/dd/healer), and in such a scenario they couldn't fit a hybrid or a supporter class (realistically they might fit hybrid in the future, but pure supporter will never have a place in FFXIV)

So you might ask "But why not ranger? They could have done the same with Archer>Ranger". Yes, but they liked the idea of using Bard instead because it seemed less obvious, more fresh and unique. I think it's just that.
There's still hope in the future if the "Multiple jobs per class" thing becomes a standard, we'll get RNG for ARC and at that point they might completely rehaul BRD and turn it into a hybrid class. (dps/supporter).
It's not a given but... I seriously hope it's gonna happen.
(altough it would feel strange to have new jobs for old classes being released and having them instantly at level cap without needing to level them :x)

[abzoluut]

I'm with you all the way..

However I think team 1.0 had those classes which the second team kept. Then they decided to bring back the classical FF jobs (WHM/BLM/WAR etc..). They ended up, like you said, needing a physical ranged dps. They gave it some support indeed. So Archer => Bard. Hmmpf, yeh thanks SE!