The less viable moves for WAR?

[MythToken]

What about Twintania? Where you literally have to rip it off the OT.


Titan ex
Garuda ex
Levi Ex
Mog ex
T5

oh so you mean the end game content?

Get off the paper number junkie train, and into the real world.

Maximizing your threat by making sure you hit every single buff debuff you have available is a joke. Threat is a joke.

Unchained+Zerk opening will do everything you need it to.

So you guys can have your 30 second 12 move combo all you want
meanwhile my dps has been going all out from the start,
while you are telling your group "hold on guys i havnt finished my full threat combo rotation yet" (nerd voice).

[SeraviEdalborez]

T5? Once you rip it off the OT you never have to worry about it again, unless your OT hit Twin with a Steel Cyclone or extra Flash or something. Which shouldn't be an issue because you pulled it off him with Provoke > Lob/Tomahawk, right? No? Oops.

An "unbuffed" BB opener, as with Kitru's not-Infuriate opening rotation, is more than often enough. Nobody's telling my group to hold back while I "ramp up".

Feel free to keep using hyperbole though. Really strengthens your argument.

[Desidious]

Guys.. Guys.. We are kinda getting off topic here. Though I've learned the importance of Unchained a bit better through the banter.

I might try the 3rd crossbar setup where I press R2 and L2 to bring it up because scrolling through multiple bars can lead to some bad follies and this should help prevent me from being in the wrong crossbar at the wrong time.

[MythToken]

T5? Once you rip it off the OT you never have to worry about it again, .

Thank you for quoting and proving my point.

You do not need a gigantic threat rotation, its just dumb. You should be focusing on not dying.

Also don't pop your best Defensive cooldown at the start of the fight, p dumb too.

add Ifrit EX to that as well, because the dps will be killing nails and you will be tank swapping. So there really is not a single point where threat will be such a big issue that you should do a crazy threat combo.

@Kitru if your combo sequence is more DPS over time I would accept that argument, I still disagree that it is necessary for threat

[Kitru]

Also don't pop your best Defensive cooldown at the start of the fight, p dumb too.

If you *need* Vengeance within the first 2 minutes of the fight, you're doing something woefully wrong (since you've all of your other CDs as well as IB). If you think that it's being wasted as a tank CD, I'd like to point out that the window in which that rotation has Vengeance active happens to be the most common period in which the first instance of regular burst damage mechanics occurs (Titan EX Mountain Buster, Ifrit EX Incinerate, Twintania DS, etc.).

The fundamental reason I use Vengeance at that point during my opening attack string is because of the Wrath stack and the reflected damage; the fact that it almost always gives me mitigation on burst attacks is just a side benefit. While it's not something you should factor into using it super often, it's important to remember that there's more to Vengeance than the DR.

@Kitru if your combo sequence is more DPS over time I would accept that argument, I still disagree that it is necessary for threat

It's significantly more damage over time (in fact, the use of the SE combo during the buffed phase is explicitly there because it's a DPS increase even if it reduces enmity gen, which would be maximized by only using BB combos) which is my entire point. Maximizing enmity generation during the buffed phase means using BB less often which translates into higher damage and greater utility/less healing required.

Enmity generation at the start of the fight doesn't matter. The difference between our usages is that I'm saying that it doesn't matter at all as long as you're not an idiot (Tomahawk>BB combo is more than enough to generate a solid enmity cushion) whereas you're saying that it doesn't matter as long as you use your CDs immediately.

Since I'm saying that opening enmity isn't an issue at all, using CDs to maximize it is wasting them which then beggars the question as to the most efficient/effective dispensation of said CDs if they're not needed for solidifying. By using those CDs in the prescribed manner (which can be done once every 2 minutes), you will get maximum damage contributions out of them as well as near maximum enmity (something like 90% of what you'd get with 3 BBs instead of 2 BBs and an SE while buffed), and the value of said maximized enmity is in allowing you to devote substantially fewer GCDs to enmity generation over the course of the entire fight, freeing you to devote those GCDs to more useful functions (since, as pretty much everyone agrees, it doesn't matter how big your enmity cushion is as long as you have one beyond the epeen of it) like damage and damage mitigation.

[MythToken]

Well said



I also never said Tomahawk>BB i said buffed Tomahawk+BB > unbuffed BB SE combo


Sort of silly to think that there was no BB coming after a Tomahawk.


Anyways I hope this discussion has showed the OP the value of many of the warriors skills.

[Lemon8or]

What about Twintania? Where you literally have to rip it off the OT.

Run in with OT -> Heavy Swing -> Provoke -> Skull Sunder -> Butcher's Block -> done

[MythToken]

Yeah we got it.

I usually just 1 tank it, in which case i do go ahead and pop Infuruiate, but not unleashed and instead save the 5 stacks for a Steel Cyclone with some flashes.

Steel Cyclone can be useful OP, not sure if that is on your bar as well.



P.S.

HS>SS>BB>HS>Maim>SE(Vengeance)>HS(Unchained)>SS(Berserk)>BB(Brutal Swing)>HS(Internal Release)>Maim>SE>HS>SS>BB>Inner Beast(Infuriate)>Inner Beast

whats your SS at? because that last inner beast isn't happening before Beserk pacifys

the rotation is def more damage regardless of this, just curious

[Shref]

Can someone give me instances where they use unchained a lot or a situational move at least. Just trying to learn.

initial pulls
anytime i'm using bloodbath. brayflox SR's for example. esp if i'm using internal release and Berserk as well. which i always do if i'm using unchained.
dps checks
any boss fight where i don't feel i'm taking excessive damage.

[MythToken]

Unchained can often come down to, am I needing that 20% damage reduction from IB consistently or not?

If I feel like I am surviving pretty well without it, and there are not huge damage spikes mechanics I have to use IB on, then I will always try to use Unchained to boost DPS.


Also I would largely ignore the giant combo sequence stated earlier in this thread, 99% of the time it's not very practical to use.
It's great on paper or on a dummy, but really as a War Tank your job is get threat which is easy, and then react to the situation while maintaining debuffs, dodging, anddoing as much dps as you can.

If you get bogged down in trying to get off the perfect rotation every time, which isn't necessary anyways, you are most likely not going to be focused on surviving or mechanics ect.