Just realized - if you're a casual gamer, ideally....

[kukurumei]

My point was that it's silly to say that casuals don't play subscription based games.

They don't anymore, when now we have newer business models. Just like itunes is #1 because it's business model destoried the competition.

Free to play or otherwise, paying for extras are much more favorable to casuals, because they "feel" they only pay if they want to, and play as they want to. The only barrier of entry is money for paying "better" items, and casuals have that in spade when you look at their spending habits.

Same with Console game, now that they have networking abilities. DLCs and "pay up front" games are doing the exact same thing. They only play when they want play and pay when they want to pay and have the same luxuries as traditional types.

You really should start looking at free to play games or DLC like games (Guild Wars) if you really believe that content is king. Because money is king. The cater to your spending habits and playing habits, and still have a server community that traditional MMO have.

You can even hang around the gift card areas of your local store and count the people suddenly walking up and buying cash shop cards...it's incredible what a business model around casuals can do.

[Rinsui]

Make 90% of the content for the 90% casuals,
and 10% for the 10% hardcores.
Sensible.

[SuzakuCMX]

They don't anymore, when now we have newer business models. Just like itunes is #1 because it's business model destoried the competition.

Free to play or otherwise, paying for extras are much more favorable to casuals, because they "feel" they only pay if they want to, and play as they want to. The only barrier of entry is money for paying "better" items, and casuals have that in spade when you look at their spending habits.

Same with Console game, now that they have networking abilities. DLCs and "pay up front" games are doing the exact same thing. They only play when they want play and pay when they want to pay and have the same luxuries as traditional types.

You really should start looking at free to play games or DLC like games (Guild Wars) if you really believe that content is king. Because money is king. The cater to your spending habits and playing habits, and still have a server community that traditional MMO have.

You can even hang around the gift card areas of your local store and count the people suddenly walking up and buying cash shop cards...it's incredible what a business model around casuals can do.

Casuals play wherever they want to play. Subscription based or not, they're going to play if they want to. As far as Guild Wars goes, it has content for casuals and for the more "hardcore" crowd.

But yes, free to play games (especially those with item malls) have larger populations...but it's also larger in general and not just in proportion to subscription based games.

[Perrin_Aybarra]

An MMORPG is not for you.
This isn't to troll, even though it seems it, it just struck me -
if I was a casual gamer, why the hell would I play a game that has so
much content (not exactly talking about XIV here guys) and only have say
a few hours (1-10) a week to play it? Here's the math;

sub free on avg is about $13 bucks a month;
well if you're only playing lets say 2-8 (median 4) hours a week,
so 16 hours a month and you're paying $0.81 for each hour you play.
Compared to MMO "hardcore" and "whatever the hell mediumcore is"
who will play a given 10-25 hours a week (median 17ish hours)
they're paying $0.19 cents for every hour.

Not only that (voodoo math), but casual gamers will most likely only
complete about 25%-40% of the actually game.

So you pay (lets say avg price for game is $55) for the game,
then casual gamers play for lets say 2-3 years max (2.5) $390
and the hardcore gamers will play for 5-7 years (6; given steady content flow) $936
so it ends up the hardcore gamers actually get what they paid for all in all.
Granted, $936's....is a freakin' lot. But given a good, continuously moving game,
I could see it being worth it. Not so much almost $400 in subs just to finish under a
quater of the game.

I just do not see why if you did not have adequate enough time to
play through 'time sinks' as people like to call challenging and difficult MMO's
would waste their time and money on a MMO.
This all leads to there should be more emphasis on hardcore content
(60%/40% at most, hardcore being higher #) because they will
A.) most likely finish most if not all content available
B.) will get the most bang for their buck
C.) will give the company the most money in return.


Well....I guess this is kinda trolling.
But, when I think of an MMO, I tend to think of the words "difficult, challenging, rewarding, in depth, etc".

Not "easy, quick, vapid, unchallenged, etc"



Bombs away.
-mini rant done-

Oh, and I don't hate casual players lol.
I just don't think that FFXIV should be most concerned with them.
If it was mostly casual, people would burn through content and be bored with the game.

I don't get your point. How is it your concerns how a person spend their earnings? Yoshi already said there would be content for both casuals and lolhardcore (people think that time = hardcore players but w/e).. the whole casual on the week nights and hardcore on the weekend concept, which sounds great to me.

the other end, casuals that can only spend 10-15hrs a week probably don't care about the $936 it cost a year to play since those people are actually working and can afford it. "Hardcore" players who can spend more than a heathyly recommended are mostly unemployed people or kids living at their parents and they are the ones not having a big income. If their parents decide they are not paying anymore then they can't play. Yoshi is smart to cater to more casual people since WE can afford this game and the more content that pleases both casuals and weekend hardcores the better the for game's community and wealth.

[geniusprime]

.

You had me until you stated the above. Do people even know what is trolling? And how are you to assume he has no "life"? The last part of you entire post was absolutely unnecessary and is attacking the OP instead discussing the actual topic at hand.

[Perrin_Aybarra]

You had me until you stated the above. Do people even know what is trolling? And how are you to assume he has no "life"? The last part of you entire post was absolutely unnecessary and is attacking the OP instead discussing the actual topic at hand.

Yup I got carried. I have no right to assume and therefore I will edit my post because after smart calculations I find that someone can spend a lot of time on this game even if they work full time and have friends/family/other responsabilities. I just think that his unbased attack on casual players are unwelcomed.

[Malakhim]

It isn't about creating content that's aimed at specific demographics like the "hardcore" or the "casual", but rather creating compelling content and then structuring it in a way that accommodates a wide variety of playstyles.

That's pretty much what varying difficulty settings, which we've had in games for decades, are for. If some people want a challenging co-op experience in Gears of War, they grab another FPS-savy buddy, dial up the difficulty to extreme and make a night of it. If someone just got home, wants to shoot up some locust but doesn't want to go through the frustration of having to restart every now and then, then tone the difficulty back to whatever they feel comfortable with and game on.

Same exact game, totally different(and equally valid) playstyles. It's all about options and playing your way, and this is where Final Fantasy XIV(and any other game really) should be.

[northernsky]

An MMORPG is not for you.
This isn't to troll, even though it seems it, it just struck me -
if I was a casual gamer, why the hell would I play a game that has so
much content (not exactly talking about XIV here guys) and only have say
a few hours (1-10) a week to play it? Here's the math;

sub free on avg is about $13 bucks a month;
well if you're only playing lets say 2-8 (median 4) hours a week,
so 16 hours a month and you're paying $0.81 for each hour you play.
Compared to MMO "hardcore" and "whatever the hell mediumcore is"
who will play a given 10-25 hours a week (median 17ish hours)
they're paying $0.19 cents for every hour.

Not only that (voodoo math), but casual gamers will most likely only
complete about 25%-40% of the actually game.

So you pay (lets say avg price for game is $55) for the game,
then casual gamers play for lets say 2-3 years max (2.5) $390
and the hardcore gamers will play for 5-7 years (6; given steady content flow) $936
so it ends up the hardcore gamers actually get what they paid for all in all.
Granted, $936's....is a freakin' lot. But given a good, continuously moving game,
I could see it being worth it. Not so much almost $400 in subs just to finish under a
quater of the game.

I just do not see why if you did not have adequate enough time to
play through 'time sinks' as people like to call challenging and difficult MMO's
would waste their time and money on a MMO.
This all leads to there should be more emphasis on hardcore content
(60%/40% at most, hardcore being higher #) because they will
A.) most likely finish most if not all content available
B.) will get the most bang for their buck
C.) will give the company the most money in return.


Well....I guess this is kinda trolling.
But, when I think of an MMO, I tend to think of the words "difficult, challenging, rewarding, in depth, etc".

Not "easy, quick, vapid, unchallenged, etc"



Bombs away.
-mini rant done-

Oh, and I don't hate casual players lol.
I just don't think that FFXIV should be most concerned with them.
If it was mostly casual, people would burn through content and be bored with the game.

But the rest of your post just described why they actually should.

Also, even if 20% of the players account for 75% of play time and server loading, the remaining 80% of the players still account for 80% of the incomes.

[geniusprime]

.

Options are definitely a good thing for it makes it more accessible to everyone.

[Akubikumo]

omg, this pissing contest is ridiculous. these absurd terms 'casual' and 'hardcore' are completely without meaning and are only thrown around to establish territory. You might as well tell my mom she really shouldn't be going to the mall since, after all, teenagers are by far the most hardcore mall shoppers. This thread is total nonsense.