Odin gear is missing something :<

[Nathan061111]

Odin armor is in fact missing something.

A practical use.

Agreed, though we will prob be able to use it as our vanity set.

However I would love Rowena to turn round and say, sorry guys that's a fake set you'll need to do a quest in Urths Gift complete and instances dungeon then trial, kill Sleipner by himself, then challenge Odin mano a mano, to get the REAL set.

Besides how is it possible to obtain Zantetsuken when Odin's still running round the Shroud?

[Shioban]

Besides how is it possible to obtain Zantetsuken when Odin's still running round the Shroud?

As Odin keeps returning anew (everytime he's defeated his weapon is collected by travelers and adventurers, sold to Rowenas collection no doubt).
Must have a stockpile of the things...


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Physics (although common now) still required a large processing time to do correctly, even on the most simple of calculations, if you multiply it across many models the overall processing time will hike. The PS3 and 'Minimum Requirement' PCs for FFXIV:ARR simply wouldn't be able to handle this, therefore (for the time being) they feel that there is no place for this.

Using Havok, Apex or Shroud cloth simulators (Or perhaps even an in-house SE version) will always cause a few issues.

http://www.havok.com/products/physics
https://developer.nvidia.com/apex-clothing
http://www.cloak-works.com/

Physical processes are expensive, having to calculate the new position for each vertices is an expensive task and the higher the poly count of the overall topology on the object, the more processing time it's going to need.

Consider the following image which shows that EACH point you see had to be "moved, rotated, bent, curved, springed". As there's more than "Just make it wavey" paramenters that have to be set in order to enforce the cloth to simulate correctly and provide the correct "spring/resistance" you desire. Leather is going to be heavier than silk for example, so you'd account for this (yet another things to process)




Currently the character limit imposed on a PC is 100, (The PS3 is lower than this, substantially). To add in correct physical cloth simulation on 100 individual charchters would be a pretty big performance dip, so capes simply aren't a possibility

"But the Guardian Corps and Infantry set have capes?"

They do, and they don't. What they have are capes that are "tucked" in, they have no physicality apart from the simple "skeletal" physics applied on a basis of the character skeleton (Basicly the joints on the body dictate what part is slightly flappy or not).
This tiny physics simulation that is avaliable has a very very low impact which is why it's already in the game.


"But Archeron and Lighting themselves actually had physical capes!"

It's hard to tell, but there's a high possibility this is just a pre-rendered animation, not a real-time physical simulation.

Excuse me, the infantry set would like to have a word with you.

"Well, why doesnt the Odin armour do the same as the Infantry Set?"

It can't, the cape is like batman HUGE. The trick being used for the Guardian Corps and Infantry set is "tucking" it into the armour, so its essentially an extension of your torso and waist, it's not an independent cloth simulation.



The cape is actually still there strangely enough just hidden (and static).
Normally the cursor with a maginifying class will only appear when you hover over a characters body, if you hover over the back of yourself or someone else wearing the Odin armour where the cape should be, you'll notice you can "click" and select their character.

So this is something they haven't actually deleted, simply made transparent for the time being as capes are far too processing heavy.


The other issue is;

CPU vs GPU based physics calcuation:

Some PCs can't do GPU based physical calculations there has to be careful consideration as to how hefty the new physics additions would be and how it would affect those doing a CPU based process.
Thankfully FFXIV:ARR has a very very low topology count on objects so it won't be too bad (but still requires thought)

"I still don't get it, why not just add it in as an extra option now?"

They're saving this for when they drop PS3 support, as they want to integrate some physical elements to the game (destructible, capes, objects) but they're only considering it when everyone can see and enjoy it.

"But games like Dark Souls use physics on lots of things at once!"

Most of those games won't actually have that much on screen that is actually physical at any given time.

In the case of Darksouls your clothes as well as the enemies are very very simple Havok calculations (A reason why people use it). Although buggy at times it has a certain charm to it that people enjoy in it's low quality (but fast processing time).
With 100+ potential physical capes/hair/obejcts this is something they'll have to add later, not now.

[Gesser]

Yes please SE.

[AmandaHuggenkiss]

That's a good point.

Why aren't there tank armours that have capes / cloaks?

[ThunderTopaz]

I wanted to make that reference about the capes...
CURSE ME FOR BEING TOO SLOW

[BlueMage]

Yes please to the shield.

Also, no chance of happening, but I'd love: Gugnir (Odin's Lance) being added to available rewards, and maybe put DRG on the list of jobs that can equip the Odin set. >_>

[Citizen_Thom]

As Odin keeps returning anew (everytime he's defeated his weapon is collected by travelers and adventurers, sold to Rowenas collection no doubt).
Must have a stockpile of the things...


----------------------------------------------

Physics (although common now) still required a large processing time to do correctly, even on the most simple of calculations, if you multiply it across many models the overall processing time will hike. The PS3 and 'Minimum Requirement' PCs for FFXIV:ARR simply wouldn't be able to handle this, therefore (for the time being) they feel that there is no place for this.

Using Havok, Apex or Shroud cloth simulators (Or perhaps even an in-house SE version) will always cause a few issues.

http://www.havok.com/products/physics
https://developer.nvidia.com/apex-clothing
http://www.cloak-works.com/

Physical processes are expensive, having to calculate the new position for each vertices is an expensive task and the higher the poly count of the overall topology on the object, the more processing time it's going to need.

Consider the following image which shows that EACH point you see had to be "moved, rotated, bent, curved, springed". As there's more than "Just make it wavey" paramenters that have to be set in order to enforce the cloth to simulate correctly and provide the correct "spring/resistance" you desire. Leather is going to be heavier than silk for example, so you'd account for this (yet another things to process)




Currently the character limit imposed on a PC is 100, (The PS3 is lower than this, substantially). To add in correct physical cloth simulation on 100 individual charchters would be a pretty big performance dip, so capes simply aren't a possibility

"But the Guardian Corps and Infantry set have capes?"

They do, and they don't. What they have are capes that are "tucked" in, they have no physicality apart from the simple "skeletal" physics applied on a basis of the character skeleton (Basicly the joints on the body dictate what part is slightly flappy or not).
This tiny physics simulation that is avaliable has a very very low impact which is why it's already in the game.


"But Archeron and Lighting themselves actually had physical capes!"

It's hard to tell, but there's a high possibility this is just a pre-rendered animation, not a real-time physical simulation.



"Well, why doesnt the Odin armour do the same as the Infantry Set?"

It can't, the cape is like batman HUGE. The trick being used for the Guardian Corps and Infantry set is "tucking" it into the armour, so its essentially an extension of your torso and waist, it's not an independent cloth simulation.



The cape is actually still there strangely enough just hidden (and static).
Normally the cursor with a maginifying class will only appear when you hover over a characters body, if you hover over the back of yourself or someone else wearing the Odin armour where the cape should be, you'll notice you can "click" and select their character.

So this is something they haven't actually deleted, simply made transparent for the time being as capes are far too processing heavy.


The other issue is;

CPU vs GPU based physics calcuation:

Some PCs can't do GPU based physical calculations there has to be careful consideration as to how hefty the new physics additions would be and how it would affect those doing a CPU based process.
Thankfully FFXIV:ARR has a very very low topology count on objects so it won't be too bad (but still requires thought)

"I still don't get it, why not just add it in as an extra option now?"

They're saving this for when they drop PS3 support, as they want to integrate some physical elements to the game (destructible, capes, objects) but they're only considering it when everyone can see and enjoy it.

"But games like Dark Souls use physics on lots of things at once!"

Most of those games won't actually have that much on screen that is actually physical at any given time.

In the case of Darksouls your clothes as well as the enemies are very very simple Havok calculations (A reason why people use it). Although buggy at times it has a certain charm to it that people enjoy in it's low quality (but fast processing time).
With 100+ potential physical capes/hair/obejcts this is something they'll have to add later, not now.

You do know that you're showing a game that is on the PS3, with a flowing cape?

[Fumijj_Gah]

The only things Odin gears are missing are stats: a beautiful armor but just for vanity and too easy to obtain.

[Shioban]

You do know that you're showing a game that is on the PS3, with a flowing cape?

Correct!

But comparing the overall memory/processing consumption of a singe-player beat-em-up/shooter to an MMO is like comparing an Elephant to a Dog in terms of size.

MMORPG use a lot of memory and processing time.

UI, Characters, Effects, Sounds, Animations, Model Loadins>Outs.

Considering everything an MMO has to do and update constantly every second to that of Batman, it's a massive difference.

Hence why the PS4 was such a breath of fresh air for the development team who sadly with the PS3 version actually reached the memory limit rather quickly and are now having to work around it.

[Mortechai]

Odin armor is in fact missing something.

A practical use.

The only things Odin gears are missing are stats: a beautiful armor but just for vanity and too easy to obtain.

In all honesty, I'm pretty certain it was never meant to be used outside of being a vanity/town gear sort of item. None of the FATE reward items are. Regardless, I still think it should have all of it's pieces :<. How can I RP as Odin when I don't have his cape or shield?