Biggest problem with XIV is XI fans

[OJtheLIONKing]

I'm agreed with OP here. I liked FFXI in its time, but SE needs to move forwards, not backwards. Even if they got every current FFXI subscriber to play FFXIV, this game wouldn't even be in the top 10 for MMO subscribers. Their first mistake was focusing on us FFXI players to the point of ignoring everything that's happened elsewhere in the market, and severely limiting their target audience in the process. Of course, the second mistake was releasing a half-finished game with half-baked "new" ideas.

FFXIV could use improvement in a lot of areas, but to succeed it needs to look forward, not backwards. FFXI players are often too insular to acknowledge that FFXI is a joke to people who don't play it because of the huge amounts of grind, dated graphics and sluggish battle pace, among other things. FFXIV has become a joke itself because of its own failings, it doesn't need 10 year old design to fix it, it needs new design that takes the best of the current market standards and improves on them.

It's an uphill battle trying to actually explain this to long time FFXI players though. I know, I am one, and it took me years to acknowledge the huge and myriad problems with the game. Still, all they often do is say "well, FFXI was pretty successful, therefore I'm right." as you've seen in most of the responses to this thread. Super Mario Brothers was pretty successful too, but if it came out exactly as it was in 1985 as a new IP today, it would fail, because gamers and game design have moved on. So should SE, FFXIV and most importantly, FFXI fans.

[Hikozaemon]

I'm agreed with OP here. I liked FFXI in its time, but SE needs to move forwards, not backwards. Even if they got every current FFXI subscriber to play FFXIV, this game wouldn't even be in the top 10 for MMO subscribers. Their first mistake was focusing on us FFXI players to the point of ignoring everything that's happened elsewhere in the market, and severely limiting their target audience in the process. Of course, the second mistake was releasing a half-finished game with half-baked "new" ideas.

FFXIV could use improvement in a lot of areas, but to succeed it needs to look forward, not backwards. FFXI players are often too insular to acknowledge that FFXI is a joke to people who don't play it because of the huge amounts of grind, dated graphics and sluggish battle pace, among other things. FFXIV has become a joke itself because of its own failings, it doesn't need 10 year old design to fix it, it needs new design that takes the best of the current market standards and improves on them.

It's an uphill battle trying to actually explain this to long time FFXI players though. I know, I am one, and it took me years to acknowledge the huge and myriad problems with the game. Still, all they often do is say "well, FFXI was pretty successful, therefore I'm right." as you've seen in most of the responses to this thread. Super Mario Brothers was pretty successful too, but if it came out exactly as it was in 1985 as a new IP today, it would fail, because gamers and game design have moved on. So should SE, FFXIV and most importantly, FFXI fans.

ff11 may of had dated graphics but it was still visually much more coherent than later released games like W0W and there was never this imaginary grind i hear all these naysayers complaining about because if you did'nt suck at the game you lvled very fast and never had an issue getting an exp party. Lots of people here are comparing ff14 too ff11 simply because it worked not because they really want to play ff11 again. And apparently new MMO standards are not working because all most every single new MMO has failed or is doing piss poor.

[Cyan]

I litter these forums with complaints and that is not helpful for anyone for the simple reason XIV cannot be turned into a brand new game over night even if the devs wanted to, so Ima gonna get over it.

FFXIV is in a rough state yes, it should not have been released, yeah yeah everybody knows that already so why whine and beat this dead horse every single day?

There is a lot that can be improved and added to FFXIV that will make it into a good game so from now on, I will concentrate on that instead of endlessly stating the obvious and whining.

I fixed your rant.

[Elexia]

I'm pretty sure XIV's problems doesn't come from players coming from a successful MMO by the same people expecting the basics to at least be similar as they worked.

[Laughlyn]

I think the biggest problem with FFXIV is the FFXI fans who just cant get over their FFXI fixation.
First of all FFXI was a mediocre PC-style mmo in a FF setting, it was dated at release, now the concept belongs in a museum.

lol gtfo, FFXI was never "Dated" at the time of release.
God knows how many years its been, but its still popular, and it has one of the best game controls in any mmo out there.
A unique skillchaining system in place unlike many other mmo's lack. (including this one)

In your oppinion the same could be said for FF 1-6 where the games didnt differ at all,
basicly same type of gameplay & they were back then the most popular games ever created.

I rather have FFXIV turned into a upgraded version of FFXI, rather than WoW, Aion or any other mmo.

And saying comparisons to FFXI isnt doing anyone any good, is completely wrong, its a
perfect "Example" of how a Freakin Awesome MMO should be, not some random bullshit
Baby-steps game, where everything is handed to you for no effort at all.

I cant even see your point of argument since most mmo's already have the same system as almost
any other mmo have, AH, housing, battlesystem, mounts, pets etc...it's a part of mmos, blaming it on FFXI ideas only is complete bull...

I've seen 100s of ideas taken from various moo and single player games since this forum opened up,
most of the mare great because FFXIV is lacking 80% of the ideas at this time.

Besides...there's absolutely nothing more pointless & boring than an MMO with same old, daily crap day out & day in.
More various daily quests, more raids, dungeons, more of everything so players dont get bored in a week.

bah...i should just go back & play FFXI rather than having to play with ppl like the OP here. (scary shit)

[_C-a-e-r-i-t-h_]

I'm agreed with OP here. I liked FFXI in its time, but SE needs to move forwards, not backwards. Even if they got every current FFXI subscriber to play FFXIV, this game wouldn't even be in the top 10 for MMO subscribers. Their first mistake was focusing on us FFXI players to the point of ignoring everything that's happened elsewhere in the market, and severely limiting their target audience in the process. Of course, the second mistake was releasing a half-finished game with half-baked "new" ideas.

FFXIV could use improvement in a lot of areas, but to succeed it needs to look forward, not backwards. FFXI players are often too insular to acknowledge that FFXI is a joke to people who don't play it because of the huge amounts of grind, dated graphics and sluggish battle pace, among other things. FFXIV has become a joke itself because of its own failings, it doesn't need 10 year old design to fix it, it needs new design that takes the best of the current market standards and improves on them.

It's an uphill battle trying to actually explain this to long time FFXI players though. I know, I am one, and it took me years to acknowledge the huge and myriad problems with the game. Still, all they often do is say "well, FFXI was pretty successful, therefore I'm right." as you've seen in most of the responses to this thread. Super Mario Brothers was pretty successful too, but if it came out exactly as it was in 1985 as a new IP today, it would fail, because gamers and game design have moved on. So should SE, FFXIV and most importantly, FFXI fans.

{Citation needed.}

So what are the top 10 MMORPGs by subscribers? Surely you didn't just pull that statistic out of your ass.

Oh, and what are the sales numbers for New Super Mario Bros. and MegaMan 9?

What kind of car do you drive? I hope it's not one that uses round tires or an internal combustion engine, 'cause that's what old cars had and you really need to be looking forward not backwards when choosing your automobile. You know the saying, "Do reinvent the wheel."

FFXIV failed because of people like you. They tried to ignore everything that made FFXI successful. Not take what worked, not improve on a proven formula, but completely start over and obstinately refuse to do anything that FFXI did. Seriously, that's probably how it went down.

"Okay so here are my ideas for FFXIV: a well-designed world, rich lore, excellent storylines, great characters..."
"Whoa wait, didn't FFXI have that stuff?"
"Yeah, it was really popular with the players so we thought we'd--"
"Fuck that shit, get rid of it. Get rid of the chocobos and airships too."
"But this is the stuff that makes it Final Fantasy."
"Your ideas are bad and you should feel bad."

Seriously. Is that what you want?

[Scherwiz]

2 words, Cookie. Guild.

[Levian]

I'm agreed with OP here. I liked FFXI in its time, but SE needs to move forwards, not backwards. Even if they got every current FFXI subscriber to play FFXIV, this game wouldn't even be in the top 10 for MMO subscribers.

Yea...about that:
•World of Warcraft – 12,000,000 (2011)
•Aion - 3,400,000 (mid 2010)
•Runescape – 1,300,000 (2009)
•Lineage – 750,000 (2009)
•Lineage II – 750,000 (2009)
•Dofus – 520,000 (mid 2010)
•Final Fantasy XI – 350,000 (mid 2010)
•Eve Online – 325,000 (2011)
•Lord of the Rings Online – 210,000 (mid 2010)
•City of Heroes/Villains - 125,000 (2009)

That's right, FFXI is STILL #7. And probably only at that because the graphics are dated and people apparently got pissed with w/e they did in 09 when the population dropped from a steady 500k down to the current 350k. My guess would be the lack of real content since 2007 (WotG release) and the slap-in-the-face addons that were crystalline prophecy, shanttoto's ascension, and moogle's kupo d'etat. It looked like SE gave up on the game, so everyone else did too.

Edit: I can't believe I almost missed your super mario bros reference. Have you f***in played ANY of the super Mario bros games released since then? Theyre literally the same old crap rehashed. Not one cotton pickin thing has changed right down to the control scheme. B still runs/shoots a fireball and A still jumps. Sometimes your biggest mistake can be breaking too far away from what works and alienating your core audience. If it ain't broke, for the love of God and all that is holy and right don't fix it.

[kaboro]

lol gtfo, FFXI was never "Dated" at the time of release.
God knows how many years its been, but its still popular, and it has one of the best game controls in any mmo out there.
A unique skillchaining system in place unlike many other mmo's lack. (including this one)

In your oppinion the same could be said for FF 1-6 where the games didnt differ at all,
basicly same type of gameplay & they were back then the most popular games ever created.

I rather have FFXIV turned into a upgraded version of FFXI, rather than WoW, Aion or any other mmo.

And saying comparisons to FFXI isnt doing anyone any good, is completely wrong, its a
perfect "Example" of how a Freakin Awesome MMO should be, not some random bullshit
Baby-steps game, where everything is handed to you for no effort at all.

I cant even see your point of argument since most mmo's already have the same system as almost
any other mmo have, AH, housing, battlesystem, mounts, pets etc...it's a part of mmos, blaming it on FFXI ideas only is complete bull...

I've seen 100s of ideas taken from various moo and single player games since this forum opened up,
most of the mare great because FFXIV is lacking 80% of the ideas at this time.

Besides...there's absolutely nothing more pointless & boring than an MMO with same old, daily crap day out & day in.
More various daily quests, more raids, dungeons, more of everything so players dont get bored in a week.

bah...i should just go back & play FFXI rather than having to play with ppl like the OP here. (scary shit)

Youd rather have ffxiv turned into ffxi than wow aion etc...thats fine with me but my point was that it can not be turned into ffxi so why beat the dead horse everyday?
My point was that these comparisons are not constructive, the devs can not turn xiv into xi, nor can they turn it into wow or aion for that matter lol.
Oh and a little advice, next time read the posts carefully before getting agressive and insulting, half of what you posted shows that you either didnt read or didnt understand my post.

[Aku]

Youd rather have ffxiv turned into ffxi than wow aion etc...thats fine with me but my point was that it can not be turned into ffxi so why beat the dead horse everyday?

Dunno, you seem perfectly happy beatting the "FFXI is evil" one...