Is anyone else bothered by the lack of incentive for mediocre players to improve?

[Ryuko]

I wish there were more mechanics that made it literally impossible to just 'leech' a fight. That way, mediocre players wouldn't be able to get past the harder content by simply buying it. Now don't get me wrong... I'm not talking about the 'morality' of selling or buying wins. I'm talking about the 'skill check' these fights are supposed to provide. The harder fights are supposed to force the mediocre players to learn to be better... but if you can just buy the fights, there is NOTHING forcing you to be better. I would argue that Twintania's DPS checks and mechanics are so tight that you can't leech it (has anyone sold Twintania wins?), but Turn 5 is going to get nerfed with the next patch, so there really is nothing to force mediocre players to learn.

[Yenn]

I would argue that Twintania's DPS checks and mechanics are so tight that you can't leech it (has anyone sold Twintania wins?), but Turn 5 is going to get nerfed with the next patch, so there really is nothing to force mediocre players to learn.

I'm certain we could sell Twintania if we were so inclined. Before we stopped raiding last month, we had a minute to spare in a regular 2/2/4 group. Dropping one tank for a random would have been fine, but I'm not sure if it would be worth the effort.

[Subucnimorning]

I would argue that Twintania's DPS checks and mechanics are so tight that you can't leech it (has anyone sold Twintania wins?), but Turn 5 is going to get nerfed with the next patch, so there really is nothing to force mediocre players to learn.

Definitely not the case. We had a DPS in our FC disconnect on engage and we failed the enrage at the end by about 2-3% (this was about a month ago if not a bit longer). I would argue that it is very possible to 7 man quite easily now.

[SarcasmMisser]

I wish there were more mechanics...

Firstly, twintania has been sold though it is situational and not at all widespread. The thing stopping carry runs isn't the difficulty but the lockout, I've heard em primal sellers say they wouldn't sacrifice their weekly t5 loot for 10m. Since you can only do it once a week it just makes sense to sell primals instead, which you can spam. T5 selling will probably be widespread in 2.2 if the twin nerfs aren't too heavy. There is really nothing in this game that can't be carried.

Secondly I agree, I want content in this game that really can't be carried. Mechanics that require a full raid to be alive, or skill checks so tight you can't skip a single member, even on min-maxed toons. 2.2 better deliver on this, and better at least be the wall that twintania used to be if not more, otherwise this game is pretty dead for progression. If they want to satisfy all crowds they need to segregate content instead of making it all try to satisfy everyone. Make the designated easy content easy, make the hard content a progression in difficulty with the most dedicated players in mind. Don't hold back, try to raise the difficulty ceiling every time.

On loot, it's not just the ease but the rng that frustrates players. I've gone 3 months without caster pants, last night in Garuda em there was a blm that was doing less than half the damage I was, and had the caster pants. Where's the meritocracy in that? Gear should be proportional to effort put in, it is after all the carrot on the stick.

[ImDingDing]

I wish there were more mechanics that made it literally impossible to just 'leech' a fight. That way, mediocre players wouldn't be able to get past the harder content by simply buying it. Now don't get me wrong... I'm not talking about the 'morality' of selling or buying wins. I'm talking about the 'skill check' these fights are supposed to provide. The harder fights are supposed to force the mediocre players to learn to be better... but if you can just buy the fights, there is NOTHING forcing you to be better. I would argue that Twintania's DPS checks and mechanics are so tight that you can't leech it (has anyone sold Twintania wins?), but Turn 5 is going to get nerfed with the next patch, so there really is nothing to force mediocre players to learn.

Yes, 5mio for T5 and you get the loot. I have seen it via /sh and PF

[JonBigwood]

I wish there were more mechanics that made it literally impossible to just 'leech' a fight. That way, mediocre players wouldn't be able to get past the harder content by simply buying it. Now don't get me wrong... I'm not talking about the 'morality' of selling or buying wins. I'm talking about the 'skill check' these fights are supposed to provide. The harder fights are supposed to force the mediocre players to learn to be better... but if you can just buy the fights, there is NOTHING forcing you to be better.

Unless you already have a group with 8 players that never make mistakes, you would then be desperate because it is impossible to find competent people as good as you to make a group able to survive that fight. Then you would win once in a lifetime and wouldn't care to repeat, if it is hard enough and has cost you enough time and effort.
Making content that just a handful of people can win, and only if they manage to group with each other, doesn't make a lot of sense, unless it is just one fight out of the main story and does not need a lot of effort from the developers to create.
Look what problems Titan HM produces for most people: The hard part (for the best skilled players too) is mostly find a group in which a high enough number of members don't make too many mistakes for the last of the fight.