Vote-Kicked from Pharos Sirus as healer

[KiraVaela]

Alright, this is really hard to judge. I completely agree with some posters here that people generally should thicken their skin and learn to accept constructive criticism. But on the other hand, this is an MMO, you are very probably dealing with people that spend lots of time in virutal reality and are not prepared for something like that.

"Do people understeand what their job is?"

9/10 will read this as "Jeez, everyone is so f-ing stupid, why do I always have to play with noobs and explain everything!".

1/10 will read this as "Ahh ok, I probably don't understeand what I'm supposed to do here, can you explain to me once more please?".

People are different, some are sensitive, some prefer when you tell them straigh up what went wrong and so on. There is no recipe what to do and behave 100% correct in eyes of whole your party. You have to feel it a little bit and adjust your wording accordingly, otherwise you have to accept there risk of being viewed as "jerk" and get a boot.

[Worm]

No, I don't.

And you'll have to excuse me while I have a difficult time taking anyone disputing the claim seriously, because most of the people upset about the OP's attitude only have the following to say anyway:

"Well you sound like a know-it-all elitist scum to me, I would have kicked you too with that attitude".

It is ridiculous how people think it's unacceptable for elitist jerks to be, well, jerks. But no one bats an eyelash when upset players attempt to to liken another player who asks for more than their party is putting down, just for the sake of completing an encounter, to a bunch of people who get so upset about the quality of another player's performance that it becomes okay to start ruthlessly berating them.

Cool your hyperbolearies here. I'm not berating him, I said he was a jerk ... and so did you, so we agree! That's literally the scope of my argument. I think his behavior was bad because he typed things like a jerk would, you think "obviously if you're good you're going to be a jerk". That's fine, think whatever you want.

However, ignoring the social component of these games while trying to quantify skill is a mistake. If someone is so elite that playing with with their inferiors causes them physical pain, then they should take all that skill and do speed runs with people from their server and avoid DF altogether. You don't need to run dutyfinder.

Also look at any "got kicked because I died once ;_;" thread and you'll see the same thing. Acting like this thread represents the worst berating of anyone ever for posting about being kicked from a party is ridiculous. This is what you invite by posting on the forum. Obviously the people who kicked him broke the rules and are wrong. However there's a reason they broke the rules and treating this guy like some messianic figure because he got kicked for a different reason than normal is ridiculous.

[KiraVaela]

-snip-

Honestly, I'm not quite sure you aren't just following some of your crafted attitude on autopilot here skipping common sense.

People missunderstand each other all the time. Mixing different cultures together makes for trouble. Does that make one of them "jerk" just because it doesn't fit your view on issue? No. People have different view on what is social component of these games. Would you classify not responding in chat at all after 2-3 wipes and then suddenly just say "gogogogo" as ignoring social component of this game? I would definitely do so.

Please, stop mentioning all those "got kicked because..." and focus on this issues if you really want to have constructive discussion here. Generalization is something you want to avoid if your intention is to solve something concrete as this case seems to be.

Also, there is no indication OP is suffering any kind of physical pain, why would you try to imply that?

[Alistaire]

Actually from your words it sounds like you were being an asshole and belittling people then stopping the progression of the team... Honestly the tank probably started the vote because he was ready to go and you were stopping the situation... You should't be targeting someone specifically and then treating them like a little kid... You yelled at them so they most likely felt like shit and then you stood over them like a parent expecting them to acknowledge what you said... You deserved the boot and it was well justified... Seriously this is not a troll post it's reality

What a terrible reply. If it looks like going in will be the same wipe, especially when the people who messed up don't even reply about being asked if they get what went wrong, you shouldn't go in. Waste of time. Better to let the guy who went in too quick take a quick wipe and redo it.

That you could post this and have 27 people like it is why a lot of people avoid this forum.

[Worm]

Also, there is no indication OP is suffering any kind of physical pain, why would you try to imply that?

It was a joke. Talk about skipping common sense! Anyway, I've got no patience to argue with another cultural relativism type. You're right, he wasn't a jerk based solely on the fact that no jerks can really ever exist. Savory that victory.

[KiraVaela]

It was a joke. Talk about skipping common sense! Anyway, I've got no patience to argue with another cultural relativism type. You're right, he wasn't a jerk based solely on the fact that no jerks can really ever exist. Savory that victory.

Sorry, but I'm not buying this. There was absolutely no indication you were trying to make a joke. Whole post you are death serious about everything and 1 sentence is supposed to be a joke? Without any smile or anything? And we are supposed to find out? Cmon...

You know, hiding behind "you are not the type I'd like to argue with" is not really cool way to give up an argument.

Also, stating blatantly obvious bullshit like "no jerks can really ever exist" won't make you look any better if you can't really support your arguments. Either open up to serious discussion and bring some real statements, or give up as a man and acknowladge your mistakes. This is not a witch-hunt.

Peace.

[NRhodes]

Actually from your words it sounds like you were being an asshole and belittling people then stopping the progression of the team...

Lawl, were you reading the situation backwards? Tbh, I don't find him belittling anyone for wanting to have verbal confirmation that they understood. If you act like a kid, you should be treated like a kid. It doesn't take but a minute to acknowledge that you understand what you were told when somebody is taking the time out of their day to walk you through and teach you something you have no idea about. Your sense of reality is the issue with most players in this game to be frank. You can't take criticism and you jump straight to assuming the worst demeanor possible when somebody starts telling you what you need to do, not even realizing they are aiding you, not hindering you.

[Kinseykinz]

it's just some players have absolutely no threshold for any criticism or even ADVICE which I would think reflects their personalities more than anything.
Vote kick system was definitely abused

1. His original advice is not what offended the other players. That WAS helpful. and if it would have been left at that, and he got vote-kicked for that, YES, he would have been unfairly ousted.
2. It's the :

So I come back, ask the BRD "why didn't you attack ads? Why didn't you stack on me?" Then they say, I did attack ads, just "go go go go." I remind them again to interrupt Lunatic VOice. Second attempt, we get to like 30% health, but only 1/3 Lunatic Voice is interrupted, brd getting hit by jump again, we wipe.

So we run back, and I am asking "Why didn't you interrupt? Do people understand what their job is?" WAR says "yeah sorry, I get it, will do better" then I say the BRDs need to do it since WAR can't reliably stun (on GCD and 40 sec cd). BRD's are silent, I ask "Do Bards understand what their role it?" -silence- Warrior goes to pull boss, and I say "I need acknowledgment from BRDs that they know what to do, don't pull boss" He stops, hesitates, then goes in while I am standing outside and I am like "dont go in" so the 2 BRD and me stay out (they still aren't saying anything, except the 1 BRD earlier is like "I did attack ads!"). So, the warrior is in there himself solo, he dies, then not entirely unexpected, I was kicked from the group.

...that was uncalled for. AND it was the part where the tank said 'yeah I got it now, I can stun it' and he told him 'no bards should do it' implying he didn't think the tank skilled enough to do it. The tank said he had it covered...it IS best to trust him with it...especially when the Bards might actually have an add targeted at the time LV needs stunned/silenced and might actually not see it's about to go off in the first place.
3. He halted gameplay to force them to do it his way.


Look, it took more than one person in that party to vote-kick him. And you're hearing one (probably one watered down) side. The OP thinks he was wronged for giving advice. He wasn't. They listened to his advice...but they were new. And didn't execute perfectly. Instead of being nice after the first wipe, he started aggressively telling each party member how to play their roles, acting like he was smarter than them...all they needed was another shot. He could have been like, 'Not bad for a first go, now you saw the battle and it's mechanics, I'm sure we can get it this time.' Instead he pissed them off.

(Sorta like how everyone knows they need to dodge plumes in titan...but very few people actually accomplish 100% dodge rate their first time in...Yelling at them 'I SAID DODGE THE PLUMES!' isn't going to help...saying something like 'not bad for a first go, now that you see some of the plume timing, lets do it again' actually might.)

[Worm]

Sorry, but I'm not buying this. There was absolutely no indication you were trying to make a joke. Whole post you are death serious about everything and 1 sentence is supposed to be a joke? Without any smile or anything? And we are supposed to find out? Cmon...

The last time someone made an ultra-literal interpretation of a post I maid they mentioned they weren't a native English speaker. Are you? Obviously saying "if doing this causes you physical pain" is hyperbole, it's referring to how unpleasant the OP seems to find his Duty Finder experiences. I'm not giving up on the argument I'm just not going to deal with relativist mumbo jumbo. No one can support an argument against someone who is questioning how we objectively and scientifically prove someone is a jerk. There's no winning against you, so you must be the winner, happy?

[KiraVaela]

-snip-

Why would you want to use hyperboles in the first place? I think it's safe to say we both agree that communication in such games (and between people generally) may be problematic and misunderstanding/bad wording cause many issues where there might be none. Why don't you just keep things simple while having an argument then? See, many people in this thread don't agree with you and support OP. If nothing this proves you have to look at this issue from relative perspective. Yes, you can keep your view, but at least be ready to discuss it with others.

This brings up this question why have you dodged my question and only answered to my footnote where I question your pathetic hyperbole.

So once more.

Would you classify not responding in chat at all after 2-3 wipes and then suddenly just say "gogogogo" as ignoring social component of this game? I would definitely do so.

Answer, please.