White Mage is Poorly designed compared to Scholar

[XNihili]

What I hate when playing WHM is the total randomness of freecure and overcure.
Most of the time, I don't need them when they pop and they don't stay up long enough to be of any real use.
Now if they could stay up until needed and even be stacked up to 2 or 3 ...

[BrodyAlgana]

snip.

There is nothing I hate about playing white mage. We are powerful healers, and when played right - you wont go out of mana all the time or get hate all the time.

[Raestloz]

What I hate when playing WHM is the total randomness of freecure and overcure.
Most of the time, I don't need them when they pop and they don't stay up long enough to be of any real use.
Now if they could stay up until needed and even be stacked up to 2 or 3 ...

Yeah, this.

What I see about White Mage and Scholars:

1. White Mage is for burst heals with threat of enmity. Evident with Cure II, Benediction, and Shroud of Saints
2. Scholar is for sustained heals. Evident with low heal potency, multiple instances of heals and sustainable flow of MP

White Mage and Black Mage are pretty much the same: they excel at what they do, but are extremely boring. White Mages are focused too much on burst heals that to keep up MP I don't do much else, and when I DO need to burst heal, MP goes down the drain. Scholars have low potency on Succor/Adloquium, but keep in mind the presence of fairy, which takes half of the potency and also half the MP cost, couple this with Aetherflow and Scholars have plenty of things to do with the "excess" MP when fight is not big. Yes, White Mage has Holy, but it pretty much costs about 12% of your MP

While I agree with the role of burst and sustain heals, I find that White Mage's skills are... lackluster.

Presence of Mind really needs some work. 3 minutes cooldown for 10s duration? I don't use it much, because with THAT cooldown, it's like Benediction: if you use it at the wrong time, you're screwed when you need it. Maybe increase the duration or lower the cooldown or change it to some kind of MP management tool, maybe have it reduce MP cost by 10 % while it's active, or change it to a defensive tool such as increased defense with it active.

We need some kind of synergy. Right now, critical heals are nice but nothing to look forward to. Adloquium criticals will always benefit the recipients: you will always receive the full benefits of the shield. Critical heals on White Mages are usually wasted by a large margin because it will usually go over the max HP limit, and when the party only has White Mage, you'll be healing even when the tank still has about 70% HP

Freecure and Overcure are not that good. Free Cure II is welcome, but since it relies on luck, it's not something I really look forward to. Cure III is bad in general, and the new Overcure makes me use it sometimes when I have enough MP to spend like water, but Cure III and Overcure really needs a complete overhaul. The situational part of Cure III is so over the top, I never used it before the new Overcure. 500 MP is just too much to spend at once with a chance of somebody not getting the cure, and getting Overcure requires you to gamble and burn your MP with Cure II.

I do think that Cure III actually needs to go altogether. I already have Medica/II, I don't need such an overly situational spell such as Cure III. I'm not saying that it doesn't have its uses, it does, but it simply is not something I look forward to like the leap of Cure to Cure II, and I cannot put it in normal rotation due to the hefty cost and the extremely small coverage area. I think the radius is less than Sacred Soil.

[Eriane]

Yeah, this.

What I see about White Mage and Scholars:

1. White Mage is for burst heals with threat of enmity. Evident with Cure II, Benediction, and Shroud of Saints
2. Scholar is for sustained heals. Evident with low heal potency, multiple instances of heals and sustainable flow of MP

In single target healing whm can't touch sch burst healing. A sch microing pet is almost always healing close to the potency of a whm cure 2. The only area where whm excel is burst aoe healing.

What low heal potency? cure and physick are the same, then add embrace.

whm cure 2 in ilvl 90 is roughly 1700 with a det build.
sch physick is roughly 1000 plus fairy at 650 for half the mana and half the threat with a crit build. Fairy heal is slightly longer, but then factor adlo. with the shield the potency is equal to cure 2 on its own. I won't bring up lustrate.

[Aeser]

In single target healing whm can't touch sch burst healing. A sch microing pet is almost always healing close to the potency of a whm cure 2. The only area where whm excel is burst aoe healing.

What low heal potency? cure and physick are the same, then add embrace.

whm cure 2 in ilvl 90 is roughly 1700 with a det build.
sch physick is roughly 1000 plus fairy at 650 for half the mana and half the threat with a crit build. Fairy heal is slightly longer, but then factor adlo. with the shield the potency is equal to cure 2 on its own. I won't bring up lustrate.

With Adloquium, the potency is 300. so unless it crits, it's still equivalent to a 600 potency, which is 50 less than cure II.
Dont forget to factor in Divine Seal, since we're talking about burst healing. Cure II goes for about ~1600 for my build. DS goes to about 2100. With Presence of Mind, if you ever use it, my cure casting time will go from 1.93 to ~1.60. factor in regen since as far as I've been able to tell, will be on the tank a majority of the time. 3255 with DS, 2555 w/o DS. I'm in iLVL 83. so the numbers should go up a bit with iLVL 90.

So dont discount WHM burst just yet.

I still believe that WHM is very lackluster in regards to synergy, with the 15% chance to trigger a free Cure II, and Cure II's 15% chance to trigger Freecure. I'm not a fan of relying on RNG to gain benefits to my class for the core abilities. one of which (freecure) is rarely used, since the window is 10 seconds (if i remember correctly). If they bumped up the duration to 30 seconds, or permament; removed upon changing areas, i believe it would be far more beneficial, but that's just food for thought. Just throwing out something.

[sharazisspecial]

Dont forget to factor in Divine Seal

Sch have cooldowns as well. They also affect allied healer too. Rouse, Fey illumination, Fey covenant and possibly Fey glow. Don't forget about lustrate too , it has a small cooldown of 3 per minute.

You are actually factoring in Presence of mind? Might as well factor in benediction while your at it. They have the same cooldown...

You are really undervaluing adloquium. The shield portion never overheals unlike your 3k cure2 crit. Regen overheals quite a bit too due to how it ticks every 3 seconds and can't be controlled or timed.

[Aeser]

i'm not forgetting anything. it was said whm cant touch sch. WHM can do pretty damn good burst healing as well. I use DS all the time, and PoM, even though it's simply just bad is still there.

I'm just talking about burst healing. I didnt include benediction since the previous person said they wouldnt include lustrate.

I'm not undervaluing anything at all. just stating the healing potential. i never included over healing since with burst healing your trying to get your tank up as fast as possible. not topping them off.

I'm also fully aware whm's are more for AoE healing, not single target/ tank healing.

i was just stating what i've observed, and made a counter point to previous poster.

[Eriane]

i'm not forgetting anything. it was said whm cant touch sch. WHM can do pretty damn good burst healing as well. I use DS all the time, and PoM, even though it's simply just bad is still there.

I'm just talking about burst healing. I didnt include benediction since the previous person said they wouldnt include lustrate.

I'm not undervaluing anything at all. just stating the healing potential. i never included over healing since with burst healing your trying to get your tank up as fast as possible. not topping them off.

I'm also fully aware whm's are more for AoE healing, not single target/ tank healing.

i was just stating what i've observed, and made a counter point to previous poster.

When I say burst I mean roughly 2.5-3 sec before the tank gets hit again, and you have to consider lustrate. Bene isn't reliable with a 5 min cd but lustrate is potentially 3 times a min.

Whm burst heal: DS Cure 2
Sch burst heal: Fey illumination, adlo, rouse, embrace, and lustrate. The adlo and embrace can be cast together and lustrate is off the gcd.
Your cure 2 crits, great, if adlo crits the shield is doubled.

There is no comparison, even moreso if you consider that with any healing debuff will wreck a whm's heals but sch lustrate isn't affected.

With Adloquium, the potency is 300. so unless it crits, it's still equivalent to a 600 potency, which is 50 less than cure II.
Dont forget to factor in Divine Seal, since we're talking about burst healing. Cure II goes for about ~1600 for my build. DS goes to about 2100. With Presence of Mind, if you ever use it, my cure casting time will go from 1.93 to ~1.60. factor in regen since as far as I've been able to tell, will be on the tank a majority of the time. 3255 with DS, 2555 w/o DS. I'm in iLVL 83. so the numbers should go up a bit with iLVL 90.

My whm is ilvl 90 with a det build. My cure is around 1100 and my cure 2 is 1700-1800.
My raid sch is ilvl 82, crit build (what else). Physick is around 1k and embrace is 650. When his adlo crits I sit back and take a break.

Why are we talking about pom? its 5 min cd.

If you want to factor in ds you have to consider fey and rouse. also keep in mind the sch have better dmg mitigation and preshielding. with less threat and better mana management. Go ahead and spam cure 2 for a bit and see how your mana is doing crumpled in a dry heap on the floor while your sch buddy is wishing he could give you some of his. This has happened to me a few times in dumb situations, like a tank without cd's tanking two dreadnaughts that ate spiders in the last phase of turn 4. I think I nearly went out of mana with bard song, sch was at half. I get that you aren't supposed to heal stupid, but a sch borderline can.

I was talking with two raiding sch from my fc yesterday and it was funny to listen to them talk about how whm regen should be off the gcd, or stoneskin improved or something. Kinda makes me giggle. Personally I wouldn't mind medica 2 being changed to just a hot. Remove the burst heal and lower the mana cost to compensate. When I need to raid heal I'm using medica or cure 3 anyway. Give us the option of having a baby heal in the background.

But don't misunderstand, I'm not saying whm is terrible or sch should be nerfed. But a few qol changes would really help. Heck, i'll even take bene actually being instant and not having the tank die as the heal goes off and the cd wasted.