Balmung is Homeless on Christmas' Eve. Is this really what you wanted, Yoshida-san?

[Abriael]

I don't think the housing costs have had any effect on account retention whatsoever. You'd have to be reeeeeeally easily upset to quit over a mostly-non-gameplay-impacting feature.

Housing is very commonly a high engagement feature in MMORPGs, because most of the times it's the only way for players to own something persistent outside of their character. SE also publicized and hyped it way beyond anything else in the patch, which contributed to raise many people's expectations.

While by itself it might not make many people quit, lack of access to a high engagement feature that in basically every other MMORPGs is made (at least at the entry level) very accessible is definitely a weakening factor for account retention, and summed up to other factors (like having to bear trolls in a high percentage of crystal tower runs due to the impossibility of safely queuing with 23 people you actually know know), it might definitely tip people over the edge.

It won't do that to me (but I've stayed through a lot of bad stuff), but I know already quite a few that are considering it.

People are also forgetting that the current housing is guild halls. They've been expensive in pretty much every MMO with a comparable feature; Personal housing will not cost as much.

And this is pretty much false. Guild housing is definitely accessible at the entry level in most other MMORPGs. The problem is exactly that there's no entry level on FFXIV's legacy servers.

I can't remember a single MMORPG in which an overwhelming percentages of guilds couldn't afford entry level housing upon implementation, and this is made even worse here by the fact that there's no other kind of housing for now.

[Duelle]

And this is pretty much false. Guild housing is definitely accessible at the entry level in most other MMORPGs. The problem is exactly that there's no entry level on FFXIV's legacy servers.

I can't remember a single MMORPG in which an overwhelming percentages of guilds couldn't afford entry level housing upon implementation, and this is made even worse here by the fact that there's no other kind of housing for now.

Lineage II. Guild halls either required you to win the auctions (which were overpriced), win a castle through castle sieges (for which you needed resources as well as manpower while hoping you don't get double-crossed at any point during the siege) or the PvP forts.

So if you were in a small clan, you better price gauge/RMT/bot your way to riches to try to win an auction (in a game that had a horrid economy due to the Grim Collector bug that NC Soft never took steps to deal with other than fix the quest), because PvP forts were always up for grabs and you could get outn umbered so quickly it wouldn't be even funny. And LOL at any hopes of taking a castle for the aforementioned reasons.

Suffice to say, no we didn't have guild housing obtainable on day 1 of implementation.

[TrystWildkey]

Lineage II. Guild halls either required you to win the auctions (which were overpriced), win a castle through castle sieges (for which you needed resources as well as manpower while hoping you don't get double-crossed at any point during the siege) or the PvP forts.

So if you were in a small clan, you better price gauge/RMT/bot your way to riches to try to win an auction (in a game that had a horrid economy due to the Grim Collector bug that NC Soft never took steps to deal with other than fix the quest), because PvP forts were always up for grabs and you could get outn umbered so quickly it wouldn't be even funny. And LOL at any hopes of taking a castle for the aforementioned reasons.

Suffice to say, no we didn't have guild housing obtainable on day 1 of implementation.

Was pricing different between worlds, or consistent?

[Duelle]

Was pricing different between worlds, or consistent?

It was consistent, but as I said, NC Soft's people didnt really care about the economy, outside of "let's price this so that it takes anyone who is legit a lot of time or luck to get this much money together".

One example still means MOST is valid. Your entire point was... idk... meaningless?

He claimed to not remember any MMORPG having housing unobtainable on day 1 of implementation. I mentioned one example of such.

The point, which you seemed to miss, is that this wasn't something that the devs wanted obtainable within a day. Yoshida took a page from the old school designs and korean MMOs because otherwise every FC from here to Atomos would have a house and add yet another item to the eternal whine list of "I have nothing to do".

I may raise a fuss if personal housing has the prices currently listed for FC Housing. As things stand I see the intent of the devs and simply shrug my shoulders.

[LiadansWhisper]

I may raise a fuss if personal housing has the prices currently listed for FC Housing. As things stand I see the intent of the devs and simply shrug my shoulders.

I wouldn't place my hopes or trust in that. They said the same thing about FC housing - that it would be affordable with only 3-5 players pooling their 1-50 gil on one job.

[SoulKhan]

They really need to add personal player housing or allow us to decorate the Inn's we stay at because this is only for FC's that have many players helping out with funds to get a guild house but Yeah i would love for them to add player housing but at a lower cost ofc

[Alhanelem]

I wouldn't place my hopes or trust in that. They said the same thing about FC housing - that it would be affordable with only 3-5 players pooling their 1-50 gil on one job.

We don't actually know that was FC housing they were talking about. They did say in the talk about pricing that personal housing would be much cheaper than FC housing.

- Food does not sell like it did before
- Crafting Mats do not sell like they did before
- Crafted Gear does not sell like it did before

Food sells less fast but prices higher. This is because food isn't lost when you die anymore. More people are actually using food.

The materia market took a bit of a hit initially but it's already bouncing back, because those rewards were one time rewards. Personally I used mine rather than sold them.

There is new crafted gear to sell (for PvP) which I made a lot of money on. the lv70 stuff is cheaper but its also easier to produce and still wanted, so it is still profitable. Furniture market will develop over time as the housing market does.

[TrystWildkey]

EDIT: you know what, I'm done. I'm tired of people coming in here to argue technicalities and try to twist our words or cloud the issue. Here is what the problems are:

1 - pricing is different on different worlds, even though ALL worlds have players that started fresh at 2.0, and ALL worlds have the same gil rewards from quests etc.
2 - pricing on the 2 server groups that include Balmung and Durandal are PROHIBITIVE and borderline PUNITIVE

If you're on a cheap server and want to say that prices are fair, I will again issue the challenge I issued yesterday. I will mail you an Ultimate Game Card so you can add Crysta to your account. Transfer to my server and THEN tell me prices are fair.

If you're coming in to these threads with the specific intent to take single statements from our arguments and twist them or nitpick them, there's no point. It doesn't change the facts and doesn't change that this situation is exceedingly unfair. You're also not going to make us look bad, because anyone who objectively looks at the pricing can SEE that it's a problem that needs to be addressed, and SHOULD be addressed sooner rather than later.

[StarMarmot]

We don't actually know that was FC housing they were talking about. They did say in the talk about pricing that personal housing would be much cheaper than FC housing.

5 million is a lot to most. Maybe they'll make it in the range of 620 million. That'd be a lot cheaper than FC housing.

[Peptaru]

He claimed to not remember any MMORPG having housing unobtainable on day 1 of implementation. I mentioned one example of such. <fair enough.

The point, which you seemed to miss, is that this wasn't something that the devs wanted obtainable within a day. Yoshida took a page from the old school designs .. add yet another item to the eternal whine list of "I have nothing to do".

I may raise a fuss if personal housing has the prices currently listed for FC Housing. As things stand I see the intent of the devs and simply shrug my shoulders.

FC Housing was touted as one the upcoming saving graces. It was going to be for all to enjoy, and brought energy back into the game. Day 1 attainment out.... but day 90 or more before even a majority has a crap house? The point you seem to be missing is that this is not even in line with what SE promoted. If the devs didn't want them attainable, they should have said so a very long time ago. That's as silly as people who think getting a house is hardcore; it is not.

Protip: Even people without houses, still say they have nothing to do, because they're not foolish enough to pay these prices. Rich people don't get rich by being stupid, and stupid people just use RMT.