Thrill of Battle

[bokchoykn]

Oh and to add to my above point, what makes Thrill of Battle really good is that it's one of the few cooldowns that can be used reactively or pre-emptively.

You can use it as an "oh shit" button when your HP spikes and you need to use it as a self-Lustrate. Or you can use it in anticipation of a damage spike that can potentially one-round you or periods where you know you will take intense damage and your healers will need the extra breathing room.

[Kal-El]

Well, it's only +hp so it doesn't really *mitigate* anything.

It increases your EHP so it does mitigate damage. Just as Rampart increases EHP on PLD.

My WAR has around 7500 HP with Defiance. I pop that before a mountain buster that'll hit me for 3k then in theory (with full HP) I have mitigated 50% of that attack as my HP is +1500 than it would be if I hadn't used it.

[Kitru]

It increases your EHP so it does mitigate damage. Just as Rampart increases EHP on PLD.

That's not mitigation. That's burst survivability, which is eHP. eHP and (mean) mitigation. (Mean) mitigation refers to how much less healing you require over a given period of time; the word "mitigation" literally means "the act of lessening the force or intensity of something unpleasant" which +hp simply does not do. eHP is simply a determination of how much punishment you can take before you require healing, which Thrill of Battle *does* do. By increasing your hp, you're not reducing the damage taken; you're simply increasing the amount of damage that you can take before you fall over. They are entirely separate constructs. Some things that modify eHP also modify mean mitigation (like DR and absorb shields), but there are plenty of things that only affect one (like pretty much everything else); in no way does this mean that they are the same thing.

Thrill of Battle does not mitigate damage just like Convalescence does not increase eHP.

My WAR has around 7500 HP with Defiance. I pop that before a mountain buster that'll hit me for 3k then in theory (with full HP) I have mitigated 50% of that attack as my HP is +1500 than it would be if I hadn't used it.

The only "mitigation" that ToB provides is derived from the heal (which is required to make the +hp actually useful since the game measures hp from the bottom rather than from the top) and said heal only has a mitigating effect if you are not topped off when the effect of ToB ends (because it drops your hp to your old max hp); the maximum amount of damage that it *can* mitigate is 20% of your max hp per use, which means that it occurs 20 seconds *after* you use it, and only once every 2 minutes which makes it provide marginally more than Second Wind (and way less than what you get out of IB or even Storm's Path) while providing you with less real control over it (since it's not really up to you what your hp is at 20 seconds from when you use it).

[Zoomie]

Blaa Blaa Blaa

You're pointlessly arguing semantics. Frankly I couldn't care less how "mitigation" is defined by whatever source you those to use to define it. While it may not "Lessen the force or intensity" it certainly "Lessens the effect" by negating a portion or even all of the damage.

ToB gives you more HP for a given time which means that the bonus HP can he used to mitigate, alleviate, reduce, diminish, lessen, lighten, weaken, attenuate, allay, ease, assuage, palliate, or relieve some damage negating the need to heal said damage. You're not "wrong" but you're also arguing for the sack of arguing. Does using lots of words make me sound smart too? I think not.

You're acting as if there is some kind of "Webster's Dictionary of Anal Retentive Tanking Terms".

8000hp + 1600hp (ToB) - 1600dmg = 8000hp!

[Kitru]

You're pointlessly arguing semantics.

No, eHP and mean mitigation are entirely difference methods of defining tank performance. You may think that it's a semantic point to separate the two, but anyone that actually cares about balance or the real effect of abilities and the situations in which those mechanics are most appropriate is going to recognize that they are entirely different and appreciate those differences.

ToB gives you more HP for a given time which means that the bonus HP can he used to mitigate, alleviate, reduce, diminish, lessen, lighten, weaken, attenuate, allay, ease, assuage, palliate, or relieve some damage negating the need to heal said damage.

Congratulations on sarcastically going and grabbing a thesaurus.

Does using lots of words make me sound smart too? I think not.

I actually look intelligent when I use lots of words because I'm actually saying something with them rather than whining that someone else pointed out that I was wrong (and then using more words to elaborate upon the topic such that it's actually been explained sufficiently) and, on top of that, I don't actually *need* to hit up a dictionary in order to know what a word means or a thesaurus to find synonyms for it.

You're acting as if there is some kind of "Webster's Dictionary of Anal Retentive Tanking Terms".

No, but there are actual agreed upon (and used) definitions for given terms used by theorycrafters, numbercrunchers, and other don't just herp-derp their way through the mechanics of the game so that they can be discussed without confusion. It's like the difference between speed and velocity: a "layman" may think that they're synonyms but someone who actually knows physics will realize that the latter is actually a speed with a given vector. It's the same exact thing here. You think that eHP and mitigation mean the exact same thing when, really, they're talking about different things.

[Gandora]

Oh my god, Kitru's argument everywhere you go on this forum. That guy never stop, what a poison >.>;

I will always recommend against macroing two skills together just for the sake of convenience. ESPECIALLY a skill that is THIS valuable to your own survival.

You know some people macro things for convenience as you mention, especialy those who play with a controller, because we've lot less space to set up our combos & JA/subclass abilities. This is not lazyness. Some people arn't good at swaping macro palette on a controller as well.

[Vactus]

You know some people macro things for convenience as you mention, especialy those who play with a controller, because we've lot less space to set up our combos & JA/subclass abilities. This is not lazyness. Some people arn't good at swaping macro palette on a controller .

True, however the macro in question is still a bad idea.

Maybe bloodbath, it doesn't see much use.

[whiskeybravo]

I use ToB in a macro because of space issues on PS3. But the way it's set up won't blow it, just press it once for the first action, then each additional press initiates the next action.

/micon "Thrill of Battle"
/ac "Thrill of Battle" <me>
/ac "Second Wind" <me>
/ac "Convalescence" <me>

May not need the <me> but I have it there anyways. I grouped them like that mainly because they are all 120 sec CD. I've always used it for recovery if in danger, never really thought about popping it before a big hit but I'll keep that in mind from now on.

[Gandora]

True, however the macro in question is still a bad idea.

I disagree with you on the fact it is a bad idea (I am not invalidating your point of view however), because from my experience macros also allow you to insert /p & <se.1+> to your actions, which is incredibly valuable when you are in PUG, or without TS/mumble/skype & the likes.

Also talking about bloodbath, while the effect is quite gimped its still better then nothing.

[Zoomie]

Congratulations on sarcastically going and grabbing a thesaurus.

Thank you, I worked hard on that one.

I actually look intelligent when I use lots of words.

Isn't that kinda like telling someone you're cool or good looking? I don't think it counts if you have to tell us...

You think that eHP and mitigation mean the exact same thing.

And yet I never said they were.

You're obviously not interested in anyone's point of view but your own and those you believe to be true. Enjoy your perceived intellectual superiority. By the way... your mother telling you you're intelligent doesn't count either