Huge SMN nerf: we're losing Thunder

[Pinworms]

If BLM's cant get bio 1, why should SMN get Thunder? I get that you're a dot class, but SMNs were slightly ahead in power until now simply because thunder got nerfed for us after beta. You're on par now, whoopdedoo, get over it. If you didnt have it in the first place would you be complaining? No. Every summoner ive talked to in game is let down, but gets why they dont have it anymore. We have one instant spell and it got nerfed. You have a pet for constant damage AND dots. We're screwed when it comes to pvp, its sleep and run for us. You know what spell BLM's get from SMN? Bio, no point. You get Swiftcast, MASSIVE use.

Yeah the cross class skills are not balanced. Even blizzard II to summoners is unbalanced. Ooo blm get ruin...w/e find me a use for it.

[mythicrose]

The team feels that even with the removal of thunder that summoners still remain an extremely potent DPS job even when compared to monk and dragoon post update.

"Feels" is the problem. While I've no doubt your team has the data available to derive the actual class-to-class comparisons, the player base only has jerry rigged parsign tools. Any tweaks done to a class will cause knee jerk reactions by various people until a working parser available to all is implemented.


Edit : Also, what's with the possible tool tip errors found in some bard skills and dragoon skills (i.e. jump is now listed at 250 potency yet combat log suggests it is still at 200 potency) ?

[PapesseLudovique]

I don't mind losing thunder in itself, but replacing it with another localized AoE was a bad move. Its bad enough we need to wade into mobs to launch Miasma II, but another one? This will only hinder our boss utility. Unless they mad buff our pets or other DoT's, this is a huge loss to dps. But I've yet to see this in action, so I could be wrong.

[Madoka]

I find myself trying to cast thunder still due to muscle memory. Then I have a giant blast of blue crap around me instead.

[Fyreus]

Except, SE never randomly nerfed SMN, they've only ever buffed it xD.

SE nerfed smn quite a few times in ffxi. At one point in time mountain buster was kicking butt and they super nerfed it.

[xxalucard]

The team feels that even with the removal of thunder that summoners still remain an extremely potent DPS job even when compared to monk and dragoon post update.

That's a fair statement, but you could remove a dragoon's jump and say it's still an extremely potent DPS job.

Why did the team decide to just totally remove thunder from our rotation?

[Ri_ri]

You know what spell BLM's get from SMN?

Eye for an Eye, Virus?

The team feels that even with the removal of thunder that summoners still remain an extremely potent DPS job even when compared to monk and dragoon post update.

The team also felt that warriors were a strong tanking job.

Edit: casting more Ruin is not fun. I don't care how strong or weak they are, if you remove a debuff from a debuff class, we are gonna whine about it.

[dragonczarxi]

and whats funny about all this? i dont miss thunder and hardly used it to begin with as it was a huge mana drain and still did great dps. the change that i have noticed and the only one is our dots no longer refresh when spread as that accounted for a decent size of aoe dmg and saveing on mana but thats my 2 cents

[Malendroit]

That's a fair statement, but you could remove a dragoon's jump and say it's still an extremely potent DPS job.

Why did the team decide to just totally remove thunder from our rotation?

I don't get the comparison as Thunder is a cross-class skill for SMN, while Jump is a primary job skill for DRG.
Elaborate, please.

[RightMSJ]

The issue wasn't that Summoners were ahead in dps or not, and that is very debatable, the problem is the class is supposed to be a DoT class and they took away one of their DoTs, which makes no sense. If the class is designed to focus on launching Dots and working around that mechanic, then they should have access to all of the DoTs in this cross class system.