GOOD JOB YOSHI P!

[Despite]

I don't have the time. Time does not equate to challenge.

Looks like you're not up to the challenge eh?
Welcome to mmos where you can't have nice things without time spent. You know.. The way is mostly been all along.
Perhaps you'd prefer logging in for the first time, making your character, then getting instant level 50 and an achievement pop-up that says
YOU WIN THE GAME!!1
After all, you don't have time to play and deserve the same things as those who do amirite?

[Matsume]

Truly, a convincing argument with flawless logic I think your white knight just leveled up again!

Let me get this, you post "sadasdasdasda" then edit in my quotes to your post so you can bypass the character limit and give me a proper response. THEN you insult me and call me a white knight before I even have the time to reply to you in like fashion (by editing my post so bypass the character limit).

Dude? Do you have any dignity or respect or honor or integrity? At least have the courtesy of according other people the same luxuries you accord yourself. Didn't see me reply to you post of "asdsasdasd" with some dickish remark do you?

And that makes me a white knight? Because I somehow have the brains to see the logic SE uses when they designed housing this way? Okay, you must be a child cus you are acting like one. Only trolls call people white knights when they are trying to have rational, intelligent, adult conversations.

[LoLo]

Its just the devs trying to mirror how housing is in real life for people getting out of college. Unobtainable so they have to move in with their parents. Too bad that it isn't fun playing real life. lol.

Don't get me wrong I am not mad and I don't care. I will be using the housing system as a way to make big bucks.

[Axidrain]

You can't RMT your AF gear, u can't RMT gear above i70, there is no +10 enchant you need to do, there is no super buff you can purchase, there is no super awesome skills you can only access with paying $, but somehow it need you to do some farming which isn't every other MMO require players to do? Welcome to the world of MMO, if you don't like farming I think there is no MMORPG out there you will like. Should probably play a MOBA, but even in MOBA 70% of time is farming as well (creep, lane, jungle w/e). Hell, even in the king of sandbox minecraft, if you play survivor mode you need to farm. So I am wondering what you can actually play.

Oh yes u can. hint hint. RMT gil traders. Plus i was talking about gil farming. I dont pay a p2p game to farm money.

[allluckys]

This means nothing to me I play mmos to kill dragons not to play in a doll house, I agree with the non legacy prices they seem very obtainable. Legacy prices though... are insane I feel so bad for all my friends on hyperion that needs to addressed.

[AjoraOak]

Dare i bring up how much Relic weapons and Mythic weapons cost in ffxi? I mean really, clearly people took the time to grind the hell out of those. Why should housing be any different? Sorry it takes time to get things. Sheesh.

Nice, comparing the casual objective(housing) with the hardcore endgame objective of a game where gear dependency was even higher... I can see all the FCs now pooling rmt like amounts of cash together just to sit in a house where you do nothing.

[Aenarion]

I didn't say everyone should do the same thing did I? Matter of fact, I myself have usezd 6 or 7 different activities to make gil. So this point is invalid.

Over your head again. The method is irrelevant, the important part is that the transactions you're accumulating your wealth on is via money transfer from other players. I merely used titan runs as an example, it can also be selling gear or materia or friggin whoring yourself out with emotes, it doesn't matter.

True, however, I did say that was a his net value, and the point i was making was that he is the Bill Gates of our server if anyone, not I. Also, the other guy i mentioned with gil cap on main and retainers from 1.0, he has at least 2-300 mil gil just after the denomination and claims to have made it all back. So again, totally missing the point.

Missing what point? I was merely pointing out the flaws in your statements there.

First of all, how do you know the primary method of wealth accumulation in the game is transfers and not generation? What official sources do you have to back up these wild claims?

You're really grasping at straws now aren't you? You really want to go there?

Tell me, how much of your money was earned via dungeon/quest/leves/guildhest/npcing item? and how much was earned from other players? The source of of gil fountains aren't exactly a secret, you might as well be questioning me how I really know if the Earth was round.

You might be right

Sorry, I'm just going to have to go laugh my ass off for 5 minutes here, the speed of your backpedaling is truly a thing of beauty.

but I'll have you know that in 1.0 the gil sellers primary method of acquiring gil was purely through gil generation.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA, really? gil seller? you're really trying to use gil seller (from 1.0 no less) to support your already-backtracked assertion that the primary source of wealth accumulation is not gil transfer?

A lot of that gil remained on legacy servers. I'll also have you know that the source of all gil transfers is gil that was once...you guessed it, generated!

Your lack of grasp on basic economic principle is truly saddening. Can you not see how meaningless that statement you just made was? I bet you didn't even notice when you went off-track did you?

What you seem to have trouble with is understanding that it has little to do with how people accumulate their wealth, this is actually more so with the presence of RMT bots - they end up picking up some of the initial gil generation.

Again, ask yourself, how did you accumulate your wealth? is it through transfer or generation? and if you had went with generation, how much wealth will you have now?

Well Well Well, there you have it. If the mega rich do indeed buy that land at such a ridiculous price then I guess all of you people complaining about the prices being too high will stfu right? Because that would prove you wrong...

At this point I don't think you'll understand even if the god of economics himself tried to slap some sense into you.

FC housing isn't meant to be purchased by the "vast majority of the player base" it is meant for Free Companies.

Hold that thought, now ask yourself, what sort of player organization are the vast majority of the player base in?

Did that light bulb go off yet?

Now, I would venture to guess that SE intended for Free Companies to be relatively large in size due to the 500 character limit. Let's just think that through for a moment. What if all these 10 man Free Companies merged and made 100 man Free Companies.

Then perhaps SE need to create something other than 4/8 man contents.

Let me get this, you post "sadasdasdasda" then edit in my quotes to your post so you can bypass the character limit and give me a proper response. THEN you insult me and call me a white knight before I even have the time to reply to you in like fashion (by editing my post so bypass the character limit).

Dude? Do you have any dignity or respect or honor or integrity? At least have the courtesy of according other people the same luxuries you accord yourself. Didn't see me reply to you post of "asdsasdasd" with some dickish remark do you?

And that makes me a white knight? Because I somehow have the brains to see the logic SE uses when they designed housing this way? Okay, you must be a child cus you are acting like one. Only trolls call people white knights when they are trying to have rational, intelligent, adult conversations.

Well, I certainly apologize, but in my defense, I had though one would actually type up a response first, then simply do a quick edit to post it. As opposed to leaving a snarky one-liner there for 20 minutes as if people should some how know you're still typing something else

[AjoraOak]

To be fair they did make 24man content, too bad it's not really 24 man premade content LOL, /clap. They always amaze me...

[Matsume]

1. Prices should be the same on every server. Not this 'based on current gil crap' Why? Because otherwise down the road (the very thing you think MY side isn't thinking about), People will purposefully avoid 'expensive worlds' in favor of 'cheap'. Heck it's gonna happen this week. People will pick up and move to cheap. (Which in the Short term, I agree SE wanted to happen...re-distribute the populations making them more even etc... but still, that is going to cause so many more issues later than if they would have had a blanket price for all.

Unfounded speculation.You are claiming to know what the future holds in store. You cannot say with anymore accuracy than I can, what people will or wont do in the future due to housing prices. That being said, there is nothing inherently wrong with people making there choice of which server to play on based on that servers economy (housing prices included). That is their choice to make, not yours. You claim that this will lead to many unintended consequences down the line but do not have any examples nor proof that this will happen. Purely doom and gloom based speculation about the future.

2. Accepting the BS that 'hey with this patch you get free housing...but you won't actually want to purchase it for 3 months unless you like lighting gil on fire' is dumb...all they did is kick the can 3 months down the road. And even then, the prices are out of proportion to what you could earn logically in that span, again depending on your server etc.

At least you admit that this point depends on your server, somewhat invalidating the point altogether. That being said, no one ever said housing was going to be "free", actually yoship has intentionall avoided talking about the price of housing for months now so it's no real surprise that they are absurdly high. YOU might not want to purchase a house for 3 months, but YOU aren't EVERYONE, and SOME people might actually have enough gil to light on fire. If they so choose to purchase a house at these absurdly high prices right off the bat, they have the right to, and believe me they will.

You can call them dumb all you want, but in the end is seems like you are just jealous of their "stupidity".

3. It completely negates any and all progress people tried to make PRE patch (regardless of server btw but esp. for 1.0 vets on legacy servers who made it a goal to save up for a house), because SE made our savings work AGAINST us, not FOR us. We all would have been better off to spend nothing, make nothing, and grind nothing until post this patch. Because at least then, the prices might still be crazy...but we wouldn't have actually made the task more difficult by letting them go...
'Hey world A, your ave FC only saved 100K gil towards a house...so based on that, your entry plots will be priced at 8 Million (but really 4 million if you're patient
-This sucks even more for 1.0 players as they are punished 3-6 times more than non legacy servers and already had their gil 'redominated' (but really confiscated)...the arguement for the 1/10th gil thing at the time was 'you won't need to buy arrows or bait (bait thing a lie btw) and to keep the gil more in line with NPC pricing...but we ALL know it was to get rid of MOST (90% of all the gil generated by 1.0) (oh and those of you touting Atmos Farming...early day 1.0 Leves would like a word with you...and they were totally legit ways of earning gil. Even an achievement for getting 100K from 1 leve...)

Speak for yourself. I have made enough gil and more since Early Access through various means (selling titan runs, gathering, crafting, farming) to purchase a first class, small plot of land on a legacy server. My progress has not been negated as you would have it, and here I am saying I am not even close to rich on my server. Remember, you can make 2-300K just off of quests lvling your first lvl 50 on a new account. Making an example out of a FC that has only saved 100K since Early access towards a house which we all new would be expensive is just a poor example of a FC's failure.

4. It is a thinly veiled 'we don't know how to handle the RMT/bot farmed gil in game' So...we're gonna punish the honest. I honestly would as would my FC: work our little butts off for the Princess Castle on the hill selling at 625Mil (our server's 321mil but making a point) if it meant:
-I never ever again in game got a /t from Giyfghe Gfgube promising 'handiwork gaur..'
-I never ever again in game saw Bfugb Audt and 12 of his buddies gathering outside Bentbrench, or Walking under the map magically hitting nodes, or all level 50 Archers wearing level 8ish gear
-I feel free to be in a town, and have shout text unblocked to not hear some RMT shouting every 3 seconds
-I never had to deal with apparent afk crafting/bots used by 'legit' players
But no...instead, all of this will get WORSE, much much worse...so my quality of life in game is even more diminished...

Or maybe it's a well concealed attempt to entrap the the RMT:

* Purchasing land or housing using gil obtained from RMT (real money trading) or other illicit means is strictily prohibited. Any land or estate hall deemed to have been purchased through such means is subject to seizure.

If the RMT are stupid enough to spend 500+ million gil under the pretense of flipping the house for future profits, SE can just take that gil out of the economy and take the house back from the RMT. Eventually gil will have decreased in the economy to the point where they will be forced to re-evaluate prices:

* The grouping listed above is subject to change based on variance in population and economy.

Just seems like an awfully convenient way for SE to trick a lot of dirty gil out of the economy.

So you can say that you're just on the side of 'be patient and wait' but no, you are stirring up trouble to stir it up. You are bragging about your friends making a killing off selling Titan runs (something I think is dirty and want no part of btw), You are bragging about your own personal wealth and making it seem like 'who cares you all can have the gils anyway'...

So again pretend you are against the high costs and patient, and we're just all impatient now now now people, but really you just came in here to stir things up, brag about your 'awesomeness' and pretend you are okay with things you aren't okay with...in hopes of convincing people to maybe, just maybe bite into SE's bait so you and your friends can swoop in and take advantage of the situation you new was jacked up all along.... really awesome of you there....

You are right, I am on the side of "be patient and wait" however you are wrong if you think I am the one stirring up the trouble in these forums. Just LOOK at the new posts page. You think ME of all people, the one defending the intention behind housing's implementation, is in fact stirring up the trouble. I say no, I say you who DEMAND of SE to do whatever it is YOU want are the ones "stirring up trouble to stir it up". This happens EVERY patch and has happened EVERY patch since 1.0. And, for you information, selling titan runs is not against the ToS and is a service like any other in the game worth gil.

I am not here to brag. Your attempts at veiling my valid arguments as immoral braggadocio are proof of your lacking arguments. I have attempted to be as vague as possible when describing my gil. I have given nothing but valid arguments based on solid reason and fact. I have given SE the BENEFIT OF THE DOUBT and the FAITH that you think they do not deserve, and you dare to say I am the one stirring up trubble while you look down on me for no good reason. At NO point have I attemted to brag. If I wanted to brag I'd be here telling you about the Scarf of Wondrous Wit I won in the forums cullinary contest or the Ahriman Necklace i'm still waiting on. How dare you, have you no shame?

Over your head again. The method is irrelevant, the important part is that the transactions you're accumulating your wealth on is via money transfer from other players. I merely used titan runs as an example, it can also be selling gear or materia or friggin whoring yourself out with emotes, it doesn't matter.

Hmm,seeing as your entire argument seems to hinge on the notion that the primary method of wealth accumulation in this game comes from player to player transfers and not via means of gil generation, I will simply ignore your childish attempts to discredit valid arguments with tongue in cheek insults, and address your primary concern.

You want to know how much of my money was earned through gil generating activities...? Well, I'm not going to get into the details for obvious reasons but I will make an allusion to 1.0. The reason I entered 2.0 with a high level goldsmith was because in 1.0 there were various means of generating gil, including, but not limited to, npcing electrum accessories (made with AH bought materials) at a profit. I knew players that had been doing this for two years on multiple accounts. They capped out gil on their mains and retainers, by generating it. What you fail to understand is that these means have not disappeared from the game. Just because you haven't figured out how to generate large sums of gil over long periods of time does not mean others haven't.

Also, I might add your response was a classic. You attempt to bolster your arguments by focussing on all of the flaws in my own. However, when I make a valid point it is completely omitted from your response. I don't expect you to acknowledge my analogy between a coil group requirement of 8 players to participate in the content and a housing gil requirement of 4 mil (cheapest server) to participate. You are just deluding yourself in the long term if you think you will have any effect on the outcome of this patch.

Well, it seems i'm at my post limit so enjoy yourselves. I hope you understand your complaints are all in vain.

[Linkschildhood]

I love all the Thank you Yoshi P threads. Its retarded.

We pay them for this product!!! I don't walk into Walmart and thank every employee there because they sell the TV I want!!!!

They thank us for supporting them and being customers.

You people have this ass backwards.