Make materia inlaying a NPC action, not a crafter action

[Peregrine]

It's fine for crafters to do single inlay guarantees.
It's not fine for them to own double inlay economies when the system already subsidizes their useless crab bow spamming.

Yoshida's initial inclination to make materia'd gear unsellable was the correct one, but a better solution is to make double inlaying a NPC action. That way there's still economic market potential, but no one discipline owns all the power. Plus you have a, albeit an imperfect, gil sink.

Again, Xenor, you have stuff to do now. Those gemmed rings will not replace themselves after people bust them trying to double inlay them.

Giving crafters exclusive rights to the first and last step of this new economy is not a smart move. Naturally TheVedis isn't going to admit that. He hears dolla dolla dolla %%% money money money $_$ in his near future.

[Peregrine]

Changed the proposition. There really is no need for the single-inlay action to be NPC-provided. Crafters can get 10 and 20k tips for their inlaying time and skill, and provide competitive pricing for gear that's already inlayed once on the market so battlers and gatherers don't have to scrounge everything up themselves if they don't want to.

But the double inlay should be an activity that every discipline profits from, since the majority of profits are already going to go to crafters who are moving their generic consumables as it is.

Think of the R50 gear system now--NPCs make that gear for you precisely to avoid the problem of crafters siphoning all the value of the NM system onto themselves. This is no different. NMs are for battlers, crafters SHOULD butt out of it. Double inlaying materia is for everyone. Crafters already benefit from one step in the process, and it's a big benefit.

[TheVedis]

There is nothing wrong with crafters controling it

They already control the price of gear(barring competition amongst each other)

Now if you dont wanna buy something, you have 2 choices

1) dont buy it
2) level the crafts up and do it your damn self

i dont see why its so hard, you are paying for something YOU ARE NOT WILLING TO DO yourself

[Xenor]

The buyers are just as bad as the crafters, if not worse.

I +2ed a shield yesterday and listed it for 15mil thinking it would never sell for that price. Well, it sold like a hot cake. I put it up before I went to do my leves and it was gone when I got back.

If you don't want me to make 27mil profit on a black pearl ring with double materia then wait until the price drops to 500k or whatever you feel it's worth. It's how I do it. All my gear is NQ apart from +1 crafting tools and my bow simply because I don't see the value in paying that massive mark up. But I'll happily sell that gear for those prices to mugs who will pay it. In fact if I ever pop out a crab bow +3 it's going straight in the wards for some mug to pay 30-50mil for rather than on my archer.

Blame the buyer not the seller lol. You're wanting to give this materia inlaying power to the buyers but it's their own faults that the prices are so high by paying it. The buyers have more power than the crafters in this game, in my opinion. It's them who decide my prices, not me. I'll generally milk them for as much as they'll give me. It sounds harsh but that's business.

[zaviermhigo]

Crafters are their own class which means they must be included in updates. this materia system is the first thing I've heard about from the devs in which a balance to this god awful economy could come. Currently crafting is the only gil sink in this game, and the rewards aren't seriously that great. But lets double gimp them, already the devs have let go of their idea of crafters being a stand alone class, and now we further this by wanting to exclude them from a major content update? that is so effing ridiculous. Eff npcs who do stuff for you, i don't even use the repair npc unless i need the tannery or w/e else buff. Not everyone wants to play a game where you go to an npc for augmentation.

[Peregrine]

The buyers are just as bad as the crafters, if not worse.

I +2ed a shield yesterday and listed it for 15mil thinking it would never sell for that price. Well, it sold like a hot cake. I put it up before I went to do my leves and it was gone when I got back.

If you don't want me to make 27mil profit on a black pearl ring with double materia then wait until the price drops to 500k or whatever you feel it's worth. It's how I do it. All my gear is NQ apart from +1 crafting tools and my bow simply because I don't see the value in paying that massive mark up. But I'll happily sell that gear for those prices to mugs who will pay it. In fact if I ever pop out a crab bow +3 it's going straight in the wards for some mug to pay 30-50mil for rather than on my archer.

Blame the buyer not the seller lol. You're wanting to give this materia inlaying power to the buyers but it's their own faults that the prices are so high by paying it. The buyers have more power than the crafters in this game, in my opinion. It's them who decide my prices, not me. I'll generally milk them for as much as they'll give me. It sounds harsh but that's business.

So I take it you're the guy who blew 400k on the garbage kite shield that's been in my bazaar for months.

Crafters will be greedy. Everyone will be greedy. Might as well spread the greed around.
I will say that as a demographic, players heavy in crafting are the most greedy discipline.

Again, they have their reward. Their trash sells now.
No need to reward them any more.

If they want to profit off double inlays, they can use the NPC like everyone else.

[Peregrine]

Crafters are their own class which means they must be included in updates. this materia system is the first thing I've heard about from the devs in which a balance to this god awful economy could come. Currently crafting is the only gil sink in this game, and the rewards aren't seriously that great. But lets double gimp them, already the devs have let go of their idea of crafters being a stand alone class, and now we further this by wanting to exclude them from a major content update? that is so effing ridiculous. Eff npcs who do stuff for you, i don't even use the repair npc unless i need the tannery or w/e else buff. Not everyone wants to play a game where you go to an npc for augmentation.

What the hell are you talking about, excluding crafters? This patch panders to crafters already. In my opinion, they don't deserve anything useful to do with their ****-spam NQ crab bows, and yet the materia system is going to give them an excuse to continue spamming gear now that it's all pretty much glorified food.

Nobody has anything to do. Crafters just whine the loudest.
The ridiculous profit potential of double inlays should be spread throughout all disciplines. Crafters already benefit the most from this update--their vast reserve of garbage gear that they generate now is worth something.

Pretty simple and clear-cut concept, really. This is a no-brainer. You either put double inlay attempts on a NPC, or you watch crafters destroy the economy with their lopsided power.

Dev's choice. Yoshida was right to initially assume that obviously materai'd gear would be R/E. I don't know why they backpedalled on that. It was the obvious correct call. Maybe it was for shameless popularity points, like giving ten year olds cake for their entrees every night.

Now that they'll be sellable, the only viable system is one where crafters guarantee one inlays, and the NPC handles the double inlays like the NPC handles NM gear synthesis.

[Xenor]

So I take it you're the guy who blew 400k on the garbage kite shield that's been in my bazaar for months.

Crafters will be greedy. Everyone will be greedy. Might as well spread the greed around.
I will say that as a demographic, players heavy in crafting are the most greedy discipline.

Again, they have their reward. Their trash sells now.
No need to reward them any more.

If they want to profit off double inlays, they can use the NPC like everyone else.

No lol I had a few from faction leves stored away.

Double inlays are supposed to be a high risk high reward investment by the crafter. Having them done by NPC takes away the risk and a good portion of the materia content.

Most people have a craft at 40+ these days so it isn't limiting it to just a few people anyway.

[Physic]

No lol I had a few from faction leves stored away.

Double inlays are supposed to be a high risk high reward investment by the crafter. Having them done by NPC takes away the risk and a good portion of the materia content.

Most people have a craft at 40+ these days so it isn't limiting it to just a few people anyway.

actually seeing as how it probably destroys the gear and the materia, and loses the catalyst, i think its supposed to by high risk high reward for the PLAYER. Putting end product in crafter hands is asking for ridiculous pricing, and refusals to try to craft.
earlier you said it wasnt worth your time, how much is your time worth? You didnt answer the question, how much would someone have to pay you to attempt to do the synth, if it is basically like a normal synth in execution, if they bring all the items. Essentially how much do they have to pay you for 2 minutes of synthing time?

[Xenor]

I did answer that question back on page one. I said 50k is probably a good amount to start at if it requires a gear change, setting up skills and running to grab support. But normally when I craft for people I let them decide what to tip. Then again I should stop that because one random guy tipped nothing once after I spent about 20 minutes on his crap.

At the end of the day most people who want end-game gear upgrading will be getting it done by their linkshell for free.