DRG is unbalanced and desperately needs a buff.

[Flionheart]

Rock is fine, Scissors needs a serious nerf.

10charrrrrr

[Dano]

Drgs get more drops in Turn 1 than anybody else

[SiinZ]

yes.. YEESSSSS... (insert evil laugh) BUFF ME, BUFF ME ALOT!!! i agree with OP 100 and 29.823499%. she makes a great point. SE should hire u. i thank you on behalf of all the dragoons of eorzea.

[Tenku]

Too many bad DRG in this thread. Even though DRG is a bit underpowered compared to other DPS, it's not that bad.

[Altena]

You make a valid point, but Black Mage wear cloth armor and have a smaller health pool, not sure what the ADS beam is but I've seen the mages in my group get one shot by that where as me on monk or dragoon can at the very least survive it. To me, that is very glass cannon, whether they are able to avoid the damage or not doesn't change the fact that if they do get hit, they're dead.

A piercing laser will practically 1-shot anyone aside from a tank. On top of this, melee have to watch for conal swipes/auto attacks, repelling cannons, firestream is much harder to dodge when you are within melee range, pacman (water type move that fans out with a wedge out of it.. idk the name) has a max range, and ranged DPS should be beyond that max range to begin with. So yeah don't even get me started on the risks of playing as a melee in T2. It is far less risky to stand at a range and pew pew with a bow or fire.

For starters, whether it's FFXI or FFXIV doesn't matter, SE has established the black mages role in parties and it's pretty much set in stone.

Wait so, Warrior in FFXI was used primarily as a DD - so that means they are a DD in this game? On that logic, my previous statement would be true. However it is not.

Everything you just said about them is who they are and how it's always been, that's not going to change and I don't think it should.

What "should" change is the balance. Sure they can have burst or AoE damage, and offer superior utility/CC. However there needs to be a balance of this. They can maintain this bursty DPS / utility role, as long as DRG excels in something that BLM does not, and currently that is not the case. As a DPS class you have one major role - and that is to do DPS. Some are also required to offer utility. From your posts you basically just admitted that BLM is "overpowered" which really it isn't, but DRG is underpowered. Much like PLD vs WAR.. PLD isn't overpowered - but WAR is definitely underpowered.

Sure, in a perfect world a mage doesn't get hit but that world doesn't exist.

How is this an argument for or against a mage? The point is there are varying degrees of risk. There are a lot more mechanics that will kill a melee then there are those that will kill a BLM. Everything a BLM has to dodge - so does a melee. So I don't really see your argument there. The advantage of ranged class - is they don't have to dodge close proximity attacks from the main boss. The disadvantage comes in the form of less HP.

People screw up, if a black mage pulls agro, or gets agro from adds there's a 90% chance they are going to die in coil, hell, if they get hit by a stray beam from one of the ads bosses they are dead.

BLM pulls agro in this game? Wait, any class pulls agro? Unless you are talking about zerging AoE trash somewhere like Turn 4, it's highly unlikely they will be pulling hate on a single target. Even in Turn 4 - 1 or 2 adds won't kill you, if you have competent healers. I don't really get your point here... Everything a range class has to worry about - a melee has to as well, and more.

My point is though, a squishy will always be a squishy no self buffs are going to stop that.

Yes, and as stated multiple times - the squishy is weighed up against the fact that they are ranged.

As for the whole class doing their role well doesn't make them unbalanced, what you think it sounds like I'm saying is completely off. When I see that the majority of the classes in this game do their role well, I think that's absolutely balanced. When a class can't perform above average no matter what the circomstances, be it player skill, gear, etc. THAT is what I consider unbalanced, and as I stated before only warrior fits the bill. Dragoon is weaker than Monk & Black Mage, but put is can indeed pull its weight in a party and perform above average. And like I said, it does need tweaks but I do not find them as weak and you're making them out to be.

You obviously don't seem to understand.

A DRG has "low" DPS when compared to other classes, of equal gear, and equal skill.
It has the lowest form of utility for a DPS class.
It is melee.
These 3 things indicate that it "does not fill its role well".

Inferior DPS & little utility, at a high risk range..
Sounds like it is totally balanced... /facepalm.

What more needs to truly be said?

[Leon_Stormrage]

As a BRD, 200 DPS is fairly low, even for pre-i90 gear to be truthfully honest.

Emm no, is a good dmg in Coil. Other example: I parse around 230 in king Tom berry when this dragon parse around 280 or more

[MagoArcano]

DRG is underpowered just as WAR is.

Thing here is, DRG needs to get buffed, base stat wise, stats on the gear it gets such as darklight, etc,etc, mechanic wise (cooldown of skills, jumps, animations,) cross skill wise, utility wise.


YOU DO NOT nerf a existing class that is working as intended such as BRD. You do this Toshida, you will only be pissing the BRD population. Buffing underpowered classes is already kind of a nerf to other classes, so do not touch classes that are working "ok".

[Kletian]

If the game was designed a bit differently, Dragoon's offtanking would be very useful. Drg's can wear some very good defense armor, have slow and stun, technically Keen Flurry is a defense buff, and most importantly, when offtanking is no longer needed they have the threat drop move. Levels 30-40 it was pretty common in my groups for the tank to die and for me to hold a boss long enough for the tank to be rezzed and provoked. Unfortunately, we already have 2+ tanks in any major dungeon, so good groups won't ever use this.

Dragoons will die the most often in a party because of low mdef, blood for blood being up, and being a melee with animation locked jumps. At least invigorate makes it easier to recover from raise.

I wish that Jump was a GCD move that we could use freely as a distance closer, backjump too with a much lower cooldown to make us the most manueveral dps.

[Mihael_Longclaw]

Monk got boned is what it got, not special treatment. While a good monk with good gear can put out high numbers over time, monk is still just a purely sustained damage class. It can't burst effectively at all. In short fights, or fights where the monk can't stay glued to the mob, the dragoon will always outdo the monk (assuming equal skill and similar gearing). If you ask me: melee DPS needs to be reworked as a whole and ranged burst/ dps classes need to be taken down a peg. Maybe implement little things, like forcing bards to stay still for their more powerful attacks, adding distance penalties and the like. Nerf black mage's refresh rates a little...something. Jobs are far from anything close to balanced at the moment.

I always give a litle smile when I have a Monk, they usually bring a ton of DPS

[Altena]

If the game was designed a bit differently, Dragoon's offtanking would be very useful. Drg's can wear some very good defense armor, have slow and stun, technically Keen Flurry is a defense buff, and most importantly, when offtanking is no longer needed they have the threat drop move. Levels 30-40 it was pretty common in my groups for the tank to die and for me to hold a boss long enough for the tank to be rezzed and provoked. Unfortunately, we already have 2+ tanks in any major dungeon, so good groups won't ever use this.

MNK has FoE which trumps this. (Passive 10% less damage taken).
Along with Second Wind, (and Mantra which is highly useful).


I do agree that in extremely rare cases they can sort of hold their ground, but holding hate off other DPS is another issue entirely.
If they were indeed to buff DRG's ability to offtank weaker adds (like the Wyverns in T5), which sure they can do - MNK still do a better job... And hold hate much easier.

There is a a video of a group solo tanking T5 and they use this method (although I am pretty sure they use a MNK).

Dragoons will die the most often in a party because of low mdef, blood for blood being up, and being a melee with animation locked jumps. At least invigorate makes it easier to recover from raise.

This is exactly right. Although this honestly comes down to being smart about when you use B4B. MNK and BRD both get B4B though..

I wish that Jump was a GCD move that we could use freely as a distance closer, backjump too with a much lower cooldown to make us the most manueveral dps.

This could work too. However don't forget that MNK and BLM both have gap closers, and BRD has a pushback (Repelling Shot)... So really it isn't that "special".
BLM's is actually extremely useful, especially with the low cooldown. You can practically pick anywhere on the map and go there without problems (provided there is someone there to hook onto).