Has SE screwed itself?

[MartaDemireux]

SE can change class skills

summon I , II are class skills (carbuncles)

for SMN summon I is titan , II garuda
for SCH I = Eos and II = Selene

Yeah, thanks to them doing that it gave me great ideas for turning GLA into DRK. Example: turning Flash into Darkness with DRK equipped. Can read it in full if anyone likes, links in my sig

[Mars_Feroshia]

I like the idea of two jobs combining to become an advanced job, WAR+DRG=DRK possibly;however you don't actually have jobs, theyre still technically classes. Jobs are just the soul crystal that equips to that class giving you new JS abilities. So in that sense how would they do advanced jobs because technically your white mage isnt 50, your cnj is 50 and your soul crystal is making you a whm.

So what good would combining two soul crystals do? There would be no new classes to attach it to unless they'd mean to throw it on an already existing class, and in that case you'd already have it level 50 (depending on the level of the class they'd stick it on) So it would basically just be, do job quests/get af, change to darklight a few hours later, then the next day do your relic and done.

[Starfox71rt]

I really just want the Jobs to have their own leveling process. Implementation wise it could be similar to the Paragon leveling of Diablo 3, merits from FFXI, etc.

Once you hit 30 (or 50), you would retain your class level but now start leveling your job as well. Your job level (JLv) would increase slower (if started at 50, I would think faster) than your class level (CLv exp would remain on par with current leveling rate), but when you leveled up your job you got a minor stat boost to the job relevant stats (ex: WHM - VIT, Piety, MND, or Spell Speed). (Side bar: this may help the SCH/SMN INTvsMND issue.)

Alternatively, you could get Job Points (FFXIV equivalent of Merits) which you could spend on expanding your job's capabilities. For those who didn't play FFXI, although there would be a cap on total points available, this would not be the same as a skill tree. I could see a multitude of areas to spend these points on: New Spells, Enhanced Potency of Spell/Skill x, Increased buff/debuff duration, Stats, Elemental Resistance (joke kinda, but would wish this meant something down the road). I would hope that these additions were minor enough that they weren't game-breaking for new players to not have but not so insignificant that there would be no point to do it.

Content wise this would add to the stuff to do for those who, for whatever reason, feel like they've run out of things to do. Sure it would be grindy by nature but a lot of this game already is. Furthermore, it would provide a better basis for adding "Advanced Jobs" (Jobs A and B at JLv x/y).

[Hilding]

Couldn't one way to solve to problem of every GLA (for example) beeing a lvl50 DRK as well on realese to make you play through "job quests" where quest rewards are new skills? Just like lvl15 and 35 quests that give you new skills for your class/jobs today.

It wouldn't need to take as much time as leveling a new class from 1-50 (or 30-50) but would still be a nice introduction to the playstyle/lore of the new job...

[Sinaloa]

tldr al posts

There are tons of posibilities to make a tank class dps viable. Thought 10 secs about it and the neatest system I would like to see is the dps doing damage equal to his %+10 on the aggrometer capped at 100. He got aggro he does 100% damage. He´s at 85% of the tank he does 95% damage. That way he had to work for his aggro with tankskills to do highdamage with his classskills.

Would be a strong singletarget DD but able to smash through trash by moves like taunting the third add and focusing on the second to stay up in aggroranges ....

Actually I want that class - Now!

[Kitru]

Thought 10 secs about it and the neatest system I would like to see is the dps doing damage equal to his %+10 on the aggrometer capped at 100. He got aggro he does 100% damage. He´s at 85% of the tank he does 95% damage. That way he had to work for his aggro with tankskills to do highdamage with his classskills.

Problems with this idea abound.

First off, it would be the only class where the DPS *would not* want the tank to actually maintain a strong threat cushion while simultaneously making it *harder* for the tank to keep aggro when the tank is struggling. Running with a *good* tank would end up completely and utterly destroying their DPS; running with a bad tank would end up having the tank itself never tanking a single thing.

Secondly, if the class ever died and had to be raised, they would have utterly abysmal DPS for the remainder of the fight. Enmity doesn't degrade over time so, the longer a fight goes on, the less a single attack matters as it relates to the percentage of total enmity. The only mechanical way for them to get a decent enmity cushion back would be for them to have Provoke, which would exacerbate the first problem, and, if they ever decided to join a FATE, unless they were amongst the very first to hit a target, they wouldn't be able to generate *any* real amount of enmity because Provoke doesn't work when someone outside of your party currently has enmity.

Third, it would require a lot more processing for each attack for the potency on every single target to go through another calculation of total enmity on every single target, which means more lag. On top of that, there wouldn't be a reliable way to determine your own comparative performance if someone outside of your group is tanking since the threat meters only provide information for your own party. Just as a backend consideration, it's more of a hassle than it's worth.

Enmity affecting anything other than who is currently being attacked is just a bad idea.

Of course, I doubt it will ever come up since Yoshi-P has already stated that, if they ever wanted to turn a tank class into a DPS job, they could just have that job remove all of the "additional enmity" benefits from the attacks and replace them with other stuff. The problem, as I see it, with turning a tank class into a DPS class is less about solving the damage/enmity problem and more about creating a compelling DPS rotation/priority since both WAR and PLD have really simple rotations (PLD is just "Halone combo spam!" and WAR is "BB>BB>SE").

[Ehayte]

Problems with this idea abound.

1) A bad tank is just going to suck no matter what, and running with a good tank would mean that the Healer and traditional DPS would be @ 40% of enmity, while the enmity based DPS would be around 80, and they would need to manage their own enmity. Have you ever done an 8-man with another tank and noticed that their enmity was significantly higher than the other characters? It would apply much the same way. Interesting that, inn'it?

2) They would just get a skill that is similar to Provoke, but puts them at, say, 75% of the highest enmity and works in FATEs? Seems pretty simple to me. OR, you could realized that they would build enmity VERY VERY quickly since they are basically multiplying their enmity generation every time they increase their damage through an enmity boosted attack, which would allow them to grab a bunch of enmity quickly, then need to back off or us utility or enmity decreasing skills to stay below the top spot.

3) Don't know about the processing, but you also have the Green/Yellow/Red idicators, and if the class gets a de-aggro ability you could shift off the top spot once you take aggro and cool your dps for a second.

This is actually a super fun idea because the class's dps would be capped by your skill on how well you can manage your enmity, and not by potency and spamming.

However, this would be iffy because it would be single most overpowered solo class EVER, lol. It might be viable with some tweaking - its a super fun idea though : D

[Sluce]

I feel like Square Enix is going to have to have to make some changes to the current system before they create more classes. With FFXI as one class you could use multiple weapons depending on play style and barrow skills from sub-jobs that augmented shared skills. This allowed them to give jobs a unrestricted number of skills and carry spells to new jobs. However, with the current UI system and such there is limiting factors with what you can do. Already my hotbars are almost filled with skills. Therefore, I don't see how they can implement more jobs as well as more skills for each job without flooding hotbars and having no where to put the new skills. I feel like it may turn out to be a really big problem later on. I think they need to re-figure out what they are doing with the amoury/job combo before they can even contemplate moving forward. Like maybe dropping the armoury and just keeping the job theme to start.

[Nonlinear314]

Cecil from FFIV was a sword and board DK tank-ish character.

[Regis]

Would you really be that disappointed in not being able to do sastasha? :P