SMN - Why it is not a very interesting job and not a good upgrade from ACN

[Crescent_Dusk]

Just make all pets do the same damage, but give them different utility. Garuda would be a debuffer, Ifrit would be offensive group buffs, and titan would be defensive group buffs.

And quite frankly the summoner should have gotten more command skills to use. I'm not keen on the fact that we use Thunder, a BLM spell, far more than we use some of our SUMMONER spells like Tri-Disaster or Ruin II, and Enkindle needs to go down to a 15 sec cd.

Eye For an Eye is a terrible spell as well that should be re-tooled. I mean, come on, an RNG long cd defensive cooldown with a weak proc effect on a low chance? What a waste of an ability.

What's the point of having Bio I and Bio II if they do the same thing? I hate redundancy. Condense the spells into one and give Bio or Bio II a different use/interaction.

Miasma II is another candidate for serious retooling.

But all of this thread is probably not getting read anyways as I've yet to see a dev post here. These posts might be better spent in the General Discussion forum.

[Borfin]

What's the point of having Bio I and Bio II if they do the same thing? I hate redundancy. Condense the spells into one and give Bio or Bio II a different use/interaction.

Bio is an instant-cast, moderate output short duration DoT. Unlike our other rotationary abilities it can be cast and refreshed on the move.
Bio II is a cast-timed high output long duration DoT. It's far more akin to Thunder than Bio.

I have issues with the themes, but don't claim that Bio II and Bio are similar when the only traits they share are non-elemental damage and the fact that they do it over time. It's like claiming that Fire and Fire II basically do the same thing. :P

[Crescent_Dusk]

Bio is an instant-cast, moderate output short duration DoT. Unlike our other rotationary abilities it can be cast and refreshed on the move.
Bio II is a cast-timed high output long duration DoT. It's far more akin to Thunder than Bio.

I have issues with the themes, but don't claim that Bio II and Bio are similar when the only traits they share are non-elemental damage and the fact that they do it over time. It's like claiming that Fire and Fire II basically do the same thing. :P

Fire and forget abilities. I don't find this restriction of 2.5 seconds convincing at all. If you can't cast it, use swiftcast.

The end result is I use up 7.5 seconds to fire off some damage, and in the meantime I spam ruin. It's utterly devoid in identity.


When you play a Monk, there is identity to the abilities. Deciding between Twin Snakes and True Strike. The abilities are not interchangeable. Flanking bonuses and when to best take advantage of those versus becoming a liability to the healers for being greedy. It's a lot more involved play.

[Kevee]

It's a lot more involved play.

If you've ever played a MNK, not really.

And SMN is involved in watching timers and planning animations.

[shinros]

If you've ever played a MNK, not really.

And SMN is involved in watching timers and planning animations.

Currently playing a monk and I personally disagree with you.

[Kevee]

And quite frankly the summoner should have gotten more command skills to use. I'm not keen on the fact that we use Thunder, a BLM spell, far more than we use some of our SUMMONER spells like Tri-Disaster or Ruin II, and Enkindle needs to go down to a 15 sec cd.

Eye For an Eye is a terrible spell as well that should be re-tooled. I mean, come on, an RNG long cd defensive cooldown with a weak proc effect on a low chance? What a waste of an ability.

What's the point of having Bio I and Bio II if they do the same thing? I hate redundancy. Condense the spells into one and give Bio or Bio II a different use/interaction.

Miasma II is another candidate for serious retooling.

What a terrible post.

Tri-Disaster has 2 niche uses. One, for the AoE root(hello there Garuda, if you still kill feathers), and for AoE damage on 4+ targets.

We use Ruin II plenty.

We're already top DPS..And you want Enkindle on a 15s CD? A skill we'd be able to get twice during Rouse/Spur? A skill that crits for upwards of 1.4k with said buffs? Wat?

Eye for an Eye is an amazing skill. -10% damage done is not small, or insignificant. You don't pop as an emergency, you pop it when you know what's coming. Titan example -- Pop it 2-3 rotations before a Tumult is coming. It will make sure the debuff is up.

Miasma II is another amazing skill. Useful AoE, useful ST, and has an amazing debuff that is useful.

[Crescent_Dusk]

What a terrible post.

Tri-Disaster has 2 niche uses. One, for the AoE root(hello there Garuda, if you still kill feathers), and for AoE damage on 4+ targets.

We use Ruin II plenty.

We're already top DPS..And you want Enkindle on a 15s CD? A skill we'd be able to get twice during Rouse/Spur? A skill that crits for upwards of 1.4k with said buffs? Wat?

Eye for an Eye is an amazing skill. -10% damage done is not small, or insignificant. You don't pop as an emergency, you pop it when you know what's coming. Titan example -- Pop it 2-3 rotations before a Tumult is coming. It will make sure the debuff is up.

Miasma II is another amazing skill. Useful AoE, useful ST, and has an amazing debuff that is useful.

Yeah, Miasma II is useful ST, with Contagion. I think I'll start ignoring the forum contrarians.

If you've ever played a MNK, not really.

And SMN is involved in watching timers and planning animations.

Yeah, Greased Lightning and Twin Snakes are not timers. Neither are Demolish and Touch of Death or Dragon Kick. And animations don't, like, apply to all other classes.

You bore me. Bye.