PLD mechanics and group tanking

[Tanaya]

...why laugh? It's more than doable to tank all the ants at once, and that is with both tanks.

I find it much more smoother to kite it as a healer.

That's both from a healer and tank perspective.

[RapBreon]

Trash tanking is about speed and holding aggro. Pretty sure it's accepted that Warriors are the absolute kinds of multi-target threat gen. Besides tanking like 4 T4 non-spider mobs, survival shouldn't be an issue.

Paladin AoE tanking is tedious as hell against good DPS, cycle through targets doing Fast>Savage>Rage is annoying.

I'm both a 50 PLD and 50 WAR. And WAR is 50x easier to hold multi-target threat with. Flash spam doesn't cut it if a geared party member wants to blow a single target up.

EDIT: Who sleeps mobs anymore? XD

EDIT2:

Because at this moment, picking them up and tanking would probably make life tougher for everyone especially the healer as opposed to tanking them all at all once (which is really like an exploit imo). I have tanked them straight up many times nonetheless, but to 'pick them up' is the 2nd best alternative at this moment, and that was an ill advise.

Whhhhhhaaaaaat? Also seriously, if a healer can't heal you through that there is some serious issues. Kiting and healing in this game is harder than just spamming Cure II at you 24/7.

[Tanaya]

Whhhhhhaaaaaat? Also seriously, if a healer can't heal you through that there is some serious issues. Kiting and healing in this game is harder than just spamming Cure II at you 24/7.

I've done both methods as a tank and a healer. I've won with both methods. I still prefer the kiting method.

Divine Seal > Regen > Win. That's literally all you have to do. -Maybe- toss on another Regen if your DPS is subpar.

[RapBreon]

I've done both methods as a tank and a healer. I've won with both methods. I still prefer the kiting method.

Divine Seal > Regen > Win. That's literally all you have to do. -Maybe- toss on another Regen if your DPS is subpar.

Most pre-50 dungeons fights are designed to teach you something. A mechanics check of some sort. Taking what is the tanks responsibility away from them is a disservice. Though to be entirely honest, I'm preaching because I don't give a shit when it comes down to it. But it does seem to be aimed at learning how to deal with adds. And having healers kite in serious content is a literal non-starter.

I'll do what it takes get it done quickest. Usually having them all grouped up and AoEing them is quickest and having my usually sub-par DF healer spam cure on me works best and if they can't handle it I'll kite for them. But you appear to be the competent one in your groups, so I commend your initiative!

[Tanaya]

I understand your point, and from a concept of learning, I'll agree. But on the other hand, it could be taken as thinking outside the box, which is just as important as getting down the mechanics.

Either way I just find dealing with the adds a lot messier than it needs to be, usually because the DPS is lacking. The Princess is weak as hell by herself, so taking the adds out of the equation almost entirely makes the fight a breeze. Maybe the straight tank method is more efficient, but I've yet to see it.

[Shuon]

@RapBreon: I believe you misunderstood me. I meant having the healer kiting should not have been made possible because having the tank learn to deal with adds would have been more educational, and the ability for a healer to kite - therefore completely circumventing this mechanic - seems like an exploit to me.

But this is an optional lvl38 dungeon... no one really cares about it and only do it for fun.... haha >.>;;

...and no, straight up tanking is never as efficient as kiting.

[RapBreon]

@RapBreon: I believe you misunderstood me. I meant having the healer kiting should not have been made possible because having the tank learn to deal with adds would have been more educational, and the ability for a healer to kite - therefore completely circumventing this mechanic - seems like an exploit to me.

Oh that makes...more sense. Kiting adds is fine, making your healer do it, is something you generally don't want.

But this is an optional lvl38 dungeon... no one really cares about it and only do it for fun.... haha >.>;;

Using CC as your baseline for your theory crafting means you're not max level and don't quite have experience with the relevant content yet. Which means you don't have all the tools, baseline equipment or experience needed to form a *complete* understanding of the role. You have no tangible end-game experience, merely theory crafting (the situational, circumstanial, non-numerical kind). This is fine. But really CC isn't a great place to take your experience and transplant them onto the end-game where it's a lot different. If your comparison was restricted solely to CC then it would be more valid.

...and no, straight up tanking is never as efficient as kiting.

Circumstantial, but in your scenario the *healer* kiting that is way less efficient. Also the mobs die slower unless you have pure ranged DPS. If the mobs need to be killed then and there (which may not be the case in CC, but it isn't lots of other places) tanking them will always be more efficient. So I'd advise against words like 'never'. Mobs don't feel attrition.

Could you kite all the mobs in T4? Sure. Would a tank die? Probably not. Would they hold aggro? Probably not. Would you kill the mobs before the next wave or at a reasonable pace? Probably not. This is usually the trend with adds in 'challenging' content, they need to die ASAP. Though kiting is viable in T4 for very specific spots in T4, it's not more efficient 'always'.

[Shuon]

you ar reading too much into this 'healer kiting' scenario.

the healer is kiting because iys always the healer getting hate. it's ok for thr healer to kite in this fight i.e. specifically myrmidon princess because the princess has very low hp, doesnt hit hard, and with 2dps and the pld/war tocus firing on it without shield oath and defiance the princess literally dies in less than a min. it is a very exceptional case, and in tgis exceptional case straight tanking is just that much more inconvenient. but anyway it doesnt really matter....

[Blaetansa]

I've had the healer kite it, and really I agree this is the only scenario where it works and would be recommended. I've done it both ways, and running around trying to pull all the ads was a lot harder than the healer kiting them. Running in a circle spamming regen while we focused down the boss quickly to end it was much easier than me running around spamming flash till I had nothing left in attempt to get and hold all those dam ads.

[shoultzilla]

Actually, when the adds spawn, as long as nobody does anything, you can toss out a quick Shield Lob and pull Hate from every single add that spawned. Drop a few quick flashes and you're good to go. In my experience though, DUR-ps like to go buck wild as soon as the Tank does something. I usually have to tell them not to do anything until after the 3rd flash.