Good Vs Bad Player

[Sixmp]

I have seen over my years of playing MMO's people talk about bad and good players.
I have been given many different reasons why players are bad and why players are good.

The one thing that does bite my ankles is how people seem to expect other people to do homework on their choice of class/job/Weps/Armor etc. Homework could be asking to be told what is going to happen just as they enter a dungeon, reading guides or watching videos of fights.

Now here is the thing. How is anybody a bad player because they chose to NOT do their homework?

The whole point of playing an MMO is about adventure, how is knowing what is going to happen before it happens an adventure?

I looked up a few definitions of Adventure..

1) An unusual and exciting, typically hazardous, experience or activity.

2) Engage in hazardous and exciting activity, esp. the exploration of unknown territory: "they had adventured into the forest".


So isn't doing homework on things going against the game type we all are supposed to love?
As it states above unknown territory is hardly unknown if you just read about it or watched it on youtube.

So back to my original point. I see people who do not do their homework being described as bad players.
How are they bad if they are doing exactly as the game type suggests. While it may take a few runs to learn what is what, their experiences while they learn are the adventure.

Wouldn't it be more realistic to point the finger of a bad player towards people who NEED to do homework to get through the adventure?

This makes sense to me how MMO's are supposed to be played. Yet so many people do their homework and take away the adventure from the experience.

How do you guys see it? agree? disagree? mixed feeling?

[MomoOG]

The reality is that MMOs have perverted the very basic goal they had initially set out to deliver. I suppose its more the players own fault cause developers have changed MMOs to meet the demands of the majority. People apparently don't want to adventure. They want a cold and calculated experience.

[Arcturius]

My FC went into coil with no knowledge of what to do and we are at turn 4 now in 3 day of raiding. (3 hours a day.) Just get into a FC that is trying to get server firsts. You will end up doing a lot of fights that there are no guides for.

[TrystWildkey]

I agree for the most part. I don't want to have to watch videos or read guides before going into a fight.

That being said, I can also see the need for these if you're bad at pattern recognition. (Like me >< )

I have a hard time with pattern recognition. I can eventually figure it out, but more often than not, I have to have someone point out the pattern to me. However, I still want to go into the fight the first time without having watched videos and studied it. The studying, for me, comes after the initial encounter.

My choice to address this, is that I plan to run the primals and some of the higher level dungeons with friends only, or with my husband as the whm in the party. He's excellent at pattern recognition and can tell me the pattern without spoiling the fun of the first run. If I need to practice a fight/dungeon/instance then I plan to do it the same way; either with friends or with a shout group that knows I'm doing this for fun and practice.

Hopefully there will be other people out there with the same desire to have fun exploring the fight with no expectations of perfection. I want to run in, throw everything I've got at it, die spectacularly, laugh about it with the group, go over some points/strategies and do it again and again until we've got it right.

[JayCommon]

Hopefully there will be other people out there with the same desire to have fun exploring the fight with no expectations of perfection.

This is how I have the most fun. The problem is, when you get to endgame these type of parties (through duty finder) are too few and far between. All throughout the main story, any time I had to use DF I got grouped with a group of first-timers. We all shared this same basic philosophy. "Let's give this a try, if we die so be it. Regroup and try again." Watching YouTube videos on fights really doesn't help me that much anyway, because there is always extra things you will learn by just actively participating in said fight. I have yet to see a YouTube video that explains every facet of a fight, they normally just go over basics. The intricacies of each fight need to be learned through trial and error.

Towards this, to answer the OP, I have a decent example of the difference between good/bad players. I orchestrated a Hydra group last night. After we had a group of 8 people, we found out that 7 of us had never done the fight before. The 8th person who had done it before had only done it from a healer's perspective so he didn't have much insight on what we needed to. He just knew, "Heal and stack middle when Hydra goes there". Those are very vague instructions for anyone who has fought Hydra. There is A LOT more to that fight than that. So I said, "It's ok, if we die we will learn from it and try again." After 2 tries most of the group had it down, except for one summoner who kept dying and not moving out of AOE quick enough, not stacking middle quick enough, not helping with the wyvern adds quick enough... Basically just not contributing enough. Although I knew it was happening, I didn't lose my cool. We died 5 times before I offered the summoner any advice. We died another 4 times before the summoner said he/she was experiencing lag spikes in the fight. We died another 2 times after that before the summoner quit the group, admitted he/she was holding us down.

I picked up a first-timer Dragoon to round out our party, explained the DRG the fight and we beat Hydra on our first attempt. It was his first experience with Hydra after we had all just ran it about 10-11 times, dying every time because of one person. After the fight, the DRG says "Sheesh thanks for the easy mode Hydra run!" I couldn't help but laugh

Good/bad players shouldn't be characterized by whether or not they can watch a damn video online. However, when there is easily enough trial and error for everyone to understand what's expected from them in a fight, and still can't pull it off, then you can start calling a player bad. A prepared fighter isn't always a good one.

[Zumi]

Good player will do their research on endgame dungeons and fights. Will make an attempt will property gear themselves and have adequate gear for what they are trying to accomplish.

Bad player is the type of player who doesn't research their class, will queue up for AK in DF having all AF and a level 40 weapon level 20-30 accessories expect to be carried and have everything explained, crys about elitists when they get called out for gear.

[Sixmp]

Good player will do their research on endgame dungeons and fights. Will make an attempt will property gear themselves and have adequate gear for what they are trying to accomplish.

Bad player is the type of player who doesn't research their class, will queue up for AK in DF having all AF and a level 40 weapon level 20-30 accessories expect to be carried and have everything explained, crys about elitists when they get called out for gear.

How are you adventuring by learning about everything in advance?
You know like playing a single player game and learning how to beat the game before actually attempting it to the best of you ability first?

[Zumi]

How are you adventuring by learning about everything in advance?
You know like playing a single player game and learning how to beat the game before actually attempting it to the best of you ability first?

It's called playing the most efficient way possible.

[Sixmp]

It's called playing the most efficient way possible.

So how does that make you a better player? You are going in with the answer for every puzzle that someone else told you?

[Codek]

Idealistically, you want like minded players playing together.

A group of players going into fights blind should not be compared to a group of players that go in knowing what to expect.

It's when these two groups mix together, that some negative consequences can arise.

Being an MMO with a diverse group of players, it should always be considered what type of group you are playing with. You should also have an idea of what is expected from you as well.

Also, DF can burn in hell.