When you look at it like this how is Warrior a worse tank?

[CurlyBruce]

Stoneskin has the same effectiveness on PLD and WAR. For example a WAR has 25% more HP than a PLD but a PLD takes 20% less damage. 20% less damage is equivalent to 25% more effective HP (ex: 4k HP on PLD would be 5k on WAR and a mob hits for 1k each hit, WAR goes down in 5 hits 1k*5=5k and PLD goes down in 5 hits 1k*.8*5=4k) So while a WAR would have a higher potency stoneskin, the PLD would lose their stoneskin effect slower so the argument that Stoneskin is somehow magically better because WAR has more HP is a fallacy.

This is also why the 15% healing boost on WAR is actually weaker than the innate healing boost that %DR mitigation gives. Going back to effective HP, the higher you make your effective HP while keeping your real max HP low, the greater the value you give to Cures because they are not subject to the reduction from damage. So in the earlier scenario where PLD had 4k and WAR had 5k, a healer cures for 1k. A WAR with Wrath 5 will receive 1000*1.15=1150 HP while a PLD still gets only 1k, but when you look at %HP healed a PLD is getting 25% of their real HP and WAR is only getting 23%. This is because if you convert the PLDs HP after curing back into effective HP, it's like he had a 25% healing boost all along. PLD with 4k HP and is sitting at 3k gets cured for 1k bringing him back up to full. Converting for effective HP the PLD has 5k HP and gets filled from 3750 to 5k, making the cure actually have a potency of 1250 ie. 25% boost.

[Terabyt3]

Wall of text crits for 5,000!

Seriously this is pretty well laid down though Curly! PLD do recieve a more effective healing somewhere around 23% to PLD's 25% (rough numbers plucked from tops of heads.

But then you've also got to take into account WAR's self heals ontop of this.

I can't remember for sure but I'm under the believe Storms Path used to give a 12 sec buff that gave all dmg done 50% hp. Like a mini bloodbath you could keep active with the correct rotation. That would be helpful if it returned and certainly make storms path useful again!

Discussion

Yeah I'm talking about crits to be fair. i'm using Garuda weap and max inner beast was arounf the 3.7k mark while second wind has topped out at 1.4k before.

With internal release and 5 wrath it's a 40% crit rate?! (I'm away from game "at work" right now and this is off the top of my head.).







P.S. this thread WAS civil until the inevitable trolls turned up. Shooooo! You are not wanted here

[CurlyBruce]

I can't remember for sure but I'm under the believe Storms Path used to give a 12 sec buff that gave all dmg done 50% hp. Like a mini bloodbath you could keep active with the correct rotation. That would be helpful if it returned and certainly make storms path useful again!

Was this in 1.0? I admit my knowledge on WAR in 1.0 is pretty much nonexistent but from 2.0 on Storm's Eye debuff just granted a 50% healing negation on the enemy. Admittedly I find it curious that I haven't found any enemies that cure themselves in this manner so kinda seems like a waste now but designing content that has enemies heal themselves and would need the 50% healing debuff from either WAR or Arcanist would be pretty cool. Granted there are enemies who have innate Regen but I'm pretty sure the debuff only applies specifically to Curative magic cast on them, similar to Wrath.

[Lemon8or]

Was this in 1.0? I admit my knowledge on WAR in 1.0 is pretty much nonexistent but from 2.0 on Storm's Eye debuff just granted a 50% healing negation on the enemy. Admittedly I find it curious that I haven't found any enemies that cure themselves in this manner so kinda seems like a waste now but designing content that has enemies heal themselves and would need the 50% healing debuff from either WAR or Arcanist would be pretty cool. Granted there are enemies who have innate Regen but I'm pretty sure the debuff only applies specifically to Curative magic cast on them, similar to Wrath.

I'm only up to Garuda HM but anyone found out that Storm's Eye healing debuff affects the add's healing to Garuda? Not like it matters since I usually get groups that burns Garuda and adds so fast they skip phases but would be interesting to know.

[Terabyt3]

I'm only up to Garuda HM but anyone found out that Storm's Eye healing debuff affects the add's healing to Garuda? Not like it matters since I usually get groups that burns Garuda and adds so fast they skip phases but would be interesting to know.

Yes and Holmgang works on the adds too! Very funny when you pull it off right and the party go how the f.......... (Note to WAR's Holmgang also cancels Demon Walls repel if you want to carry on DPS'ing and looking cool)

[Terabyt3]

CIVILISED DISCUSSION!

Yeah it was in 1.0 iirc. At the minute Storm's Path is worthless curing you for 150~ at the end of a combo. Better off using Eye and getting the extra 10% dmg buff.

I spent most time on 1.0 as GLA on Excalibur (didn't pay to play but played up until subs were req'd)

Storm's Path has had a few incarnations i think?

It's current: Combo:Main Additional: Restores 50% of dmg dealt as HP

Another: Combo:Maim Additional: Restores 20% of damage dealt up to a maximum of 10% max HP

And finally what it should be and was in 1.0 iirc: Additional restores 50% of damage dealt as HP Duration 12s.

The last one would mean that yeah it only cures for 150 ish but for 12secs every attack thereafter does too and becomes a meaningful slot.


Personally I'd like to see it Combo with Skull Sunder. Since Maim is 30 secs and Path and Eye only 12 (if this change was the case).


That way You'd run a Butchers combo twice, A maim combo ending in eye, then a path combo and repeat to keep all buffs active.

[hola]

Yeah I'm talking about crits to be fair. i'm using Garuda weap and max inner beast was arounf the 3.7k mark while second wind has topped out at 1.4k before.

With internal release and 5 wrath it's a 40% crit rate?! (I'm away from game "at work" right now and this is off the top of my head.).






P.S. this thread WAS civil until the inevitable trolls turned up. Shooooo! You are not wanted here

3,7k IB heal with garuda weapon

screenshot or you are pulling it out of your @SS

[CurlyBruce]

3,7k IB heal with garuda weapon

screenshot or you are pulling it out of your @SS

To get a 3.7k IB heal (assuming including Bloodpath 25% otherwise it's even less possible) you'd need to deal 1138 on a crit IB. Accounting for the 50% crit boost, that means you'd need to deal 759 IB. On garuda weapon (41WD) with 238 Determination, which honestly is generous given WAR, you would need 480 Strength. This is already including Maim 20% boost, Berserk 50% Attack Boost, and Storm's Eye 10% debuff. So yeah, unless I see picture proof this is pretty bogus. Even if you had Bravura+1 you would still need 460 Strength to reach that level of Inner Beast and it would still have to be a crit so you know.....not really something you can count on.