Yoshi P talks about Warriors- from Producer Letter Live @ TGS

[HiirNoivl]

Quite a bit huh?

For perspective, how often has the community been wrong?

[Mapleine]

How can Yoshi P be wrong about his own Game...?

How can anyone even think that way?

The level of hubris is too high...

Same way Greg Street was consistently wrong about his game and did copious amounts of backpedaling because he thought his handful of designers and controlled test environments a better stage than scores of players whom dedicate themselves solely to a single class actually playing the game in real, uncontrolled environments crunching hard math.

There's a lot of trash, buff/nerf begging and other nonsense to sift through concerning these games, but when you're hitting general consensus with as much data as we've seen spread across the internet, then the hubris is the other way around to think you know more than the playerbase.

You can tell Yoshi P is the veteran of a lot of western MMOs, but you can also tell where his experience ends, as when your game has a whopping two tanks (or 1.5 right now, as some would say) then your players shouldn't have to be having blind, worried conversations about one being broken. Especially when each job only has one role currently (bar Arcanist) so if you're less than ideal at it you get completely sidelined.

[Conna]

Quite a bit huh?

For perspective, how often has the community been wrong?

Hmm when it comes to things such as damage fairly often, however when it comes to things like throughput and tanking not often at all.

[hola]

Your history with SE must not go back very far. SE also thought that in ffxi warrior made a good tank...this was false. They thought Ninja damage was really good...this was false. SE has been wrong quite a bit actually,and unfortunately it takes them some time to realize that they screw it and correct problems all the time.

ffxi was produced by a guy who dont play game at all, not by yoshida.

yoshida is a hardcore online gamer. he is a huge wow fan, im pretty sure he knows how fast and frequent blizzard adjust class balance for wow.

[HiirNoivl]

Hmm when it comes to things such as damage fairly often, however when it comes to things like throughput and tanking not often at all.

Well, isn't WAR mitigation supposed to be damage?

[hola]

Try this:

I have several damage mitigation rotations - that always keeps me healthed up, giving the healer less work. I have tanked every dungeon boss this way, and it works great. I also have excellent gear, because I believe in not being a burden.
1) When the boss is auto attacking you, you should have bloodbath plus vengeance up (first thing). OR, Foresight, and after it's gone INTO bloodbath plus vengeance.
you are now using the heavy>sunder>block combo to ramp hate. DO NOT USE FLASH OR FEATHERFOOT during this. You need the vengeance hits TO HEAL YOURSELF and build hate.

2) After that cools down, you should use convalescence into second wind when you're down about 500 health or so. Try to use it BEFORE your whm is spamming cure.

3) Then use thrill of battle. (or convalescence thrill)

4) THEN use flash, and also featherfoot if you equip it. (I don't, just flash and provoke)

5) You are now using heavy>maim>storms path. This move heals you as much as cure. This combo should be used often - once the boss is 1/3, your hate is huge already. Don't worry about BB as much at this point. Throw a fracture in as well (Does BB damage). This is important > you should do this combo once every time maim/fracture wears off - and you should be doing heavy>maim>storms path to keep healing yourself during the phases of the fight.

6) Stun the boss when you can to cancel a big move, then, in the 5 seconds you have DO:

7) Berzerk, Inner Beast to heal for like 1000+. Infuriate immediately.

8) vengeance + bath is now back up. Rinse, repeat.

it goes without saying you're doing other things in the middle of this. Flash, provoke, maybe even a tomahawk when they run away to do a move or they do eminity ignoring random target moves. Things like that. Think on your feet.

Unchained + the heavy>Maim>storm>fracture combo is really good if you're doing well and don't need an inner beast.

Keep infuriate up whenever possible. If the boss is unstunnable, use Brutal Swing on the second swing animation of butcher's block when blood + vengance is up. It's off the GCD and you get all four hits, even if the animation doesn't show.

Use Mercy Stroke on adds by tabbing to them just before they die, hitting it, and tabbing back - MASSIVE health bonus there: and it works on stupid stuff like objects you have to kill (rocks, crystals, etc). Storm's Eye should be used ONCE before fracture when you have it. it's not nearly as useful as storm's path for single target tanking - because you get no bonus health from it - it's essentially a DOT like fracture. Do it once every fracture.

LOL just LOL

[Kitru]

Sounds like your twisting situations into PLD's favor by comparing a WAR tanking to a PLD DDing

No, I'm talking about both classes using the tools at their disposal. Fight or Flight is way better than Berserk and PLD gets a *crapton* of damage out of Circle of Scorn and Spirits Within. I've done the math *numerous* times and there's not one whit of evidence that WAR does more damage than a PLD. Whenever I do the math for a PLD in Sword Oath, I compare to a WAR outside of Defiance and, whenever I do the math for a PLD in Shield Oath, I compare to WAR in Defiance.

Just because what I'm saying doesn't agree with what you want to believe doesn't mean that I'm making amateurish mistakes that any idiot could find. The math that's been done has been independently confirmed by other people. The math has been done *several* times and is right there for anyone to see. The only people saying that WAR does more damage than PLD are those people that haven't actually looked at the damage that the two deal and just go off of gut reactions ("2h axe does more damage than 1h sword!" "Maim is huge advantage!"; neither of those is true).

[hola]

dont worry

if enough people whine about war being too weak, im pretty sure they will change it.

[Kitru]

Well, isn't WAR mitigation supposed to be damage?

No. WAR mitigation is supposed to be mitigation.

[Kitru]

You forgot Fey Light. :P

And I currently have no SkSp on my body. I was testing other things soz.

You just said you had a crapton of SkSP on, which is why you had a GCD of 1.25 seconds. Furthermore, Fey Light is only 30% skill speed. That would bring you down to a whole 1.687, and that's assuming that you're running with 2 SCH healers who elect to use their low healing pet and sync their Fey Lights perfectly. Your numbers are *still* completely full of shit.

You just keep backtracking more and more when it's pointed out how little you actually know about stuff, don't you?