Threads starting to sound like my Tech Support job.

[Gauntduo]

To be fair, Artists are taught to study other artists that are more succusful then them so they themselves can improve and be succusful. As my digital media instructor once said, "There is no reason to reinvent the wheel if the framework already exists"

In this games case, he looked at succusful MMO's and saw what they had to offer for thier subscription fees. If the team did not provide the same services the game would not succeed. Reference is always a key part in art. As a writer I'm sure you have certain authors you feel you like to emulate or get inspired from?

And in reference to rabbitzero, Your probaly right, just not used to the flak that forums bring. I was under the impression they were for advice and tips and tricks for accomplishing things. Oh well, anyway the interview i linked he adresses the issues that people are talking about. I especialy enjoyed the Extermination comment on gold sellers XD

[Rydin]

That makes the rest of your reply quite hilarious.

So glad I could entertain you

[Noata]

Generally that is the intention of forums, I think though much of what you are looking for would not be part of general discussion. which would more accurately be titled, Bucket of tears. It is usually just full of whiners. Though now that you mention it a Guide would be fun to make.

[Tricksy]

Whining about whining, is like vaquebooking. Passive aggressive, accomplishes nothing positive and creates pushback.

But it does show us in an ironic way that whining, although derided by many who hear it, is a human function for expressing dissatisfaction. We cannot be hypocritical and ignore that.

People will whine about this game, a lot. It's going to happen. Sometimes we might not think its justified. In those cases, perhaps we should use our energies to explain why we feel that way, and what the silver lining or alternative perspective on the issue is. In that way, instead of our reciprocal whining pushing onlookers to empathize with the original complaint, we can bring people to a different and more positive way of thinking. Maybe even convince the OP as well.

We're all human. Im in a good mood, going to a potluck. So just throwing this out there.

[Noata]

Whining about whining, is like vaquebooking. Passive aggressive, accomplishes nothing positive and creates pushback.

But it does show us in an ironic way that whining, although derided by many who hear it, is a human function for expressing dissatisfaction. We cannot be hypocritical and ignore that.

People will whine about this game, a lot. It's going to happen. Sometimes we might not think its justified. In those cases, perhaps we should use our energies to explain why we feel that way, and what the silver lining or alternative perspective on the issue is. In that way, instead of our reciprocal whining pushing onlookers to empathize with the original complaint, we can bring people to a different and more positive way of thinking. Maybe even convince the OP as well.

We're all human. Im in a good mood, going to a potluck. So just throwing this out there.

Enjoy the potluck

I think the issue was about the Whine to non whine ratio. with them saying the true purpose of the forums is being lost. So it did touch up on whiners but also addressed that its becoming too common. Also if people excepted constructive feedback from their whine posts we wouldn't have posts like these where people vent the frustration of dealing with such behavior. Though that is just my personal take.

[Rydin]

Whining about whining, is like vaquebooking. Passive aggressive, accomplishes nothing positive and creates pushback.

But it does show us in an ironic way that whining, although derided by many who hear it, is a human function for expressing dissatisfaction. We cannot be hypocritical and ignore that.

People will whine about this game, a lot. It's going to happen. Sometimes we might not think its justified. In those cases, perhaps we should use our energies to explain why we feel that way, and what the silver lining or alternative perspective on the issue is. In that way, instead of our reciprocal whining pushing onlookers to empathize with the original complaint, we can bring people to a different and more positive way of thinking. Maybe even convince the OP as well.

We're all human. Im in a good mood, going to a potluck. So just throwing this out there.

that's interesting.
If I go to the grocery store and buy milk... Promptly take it home and start to drink it and notice it's spoiled....
Am I "whining" if I go to the store wanting an exchange or refund?
Am I "Crying" or "Complaining?"

Is this the only industry where a dissatisfied customer is subject to such derogatory names as "Whiner?"

Frankly, the complaints only highlight peoples desire to actually play and enjoy the game.
I would imagine someone who hates a game would just quit without saying anything. A forum post wouldn't even be worth the effort.
But People saying "I'd like to see X in the game" or "I'd like to see SE work on Y." These sound like comments from people who actually want to play the game and see it improve.

Frankly... SE's foreseeable errors with this launch could have been avoided, yet they were not. I think customers have every right to voice displeasure. Anyone who doesn't agree is clearly living in the wrong era.

Furthermore, even within the video game community, SE is one of the few companies afforded the luxury of unwavering fealty from it's subjects. Had EA or Activision Blizzard made SE's mistakes they'd be Jim Caviezel'd (crucified)
Hell, EA was voted worst company in America based on how it handled the SimCity launch. A launch, might I add, that was uncannily similar to this one.

[Noata]

Well they were not foreseeable and they started the plans for upgrading the servers when they saw their numbers in early access, numbers which greatly exceeded the Beta 4, free entry beta test. so really thy didnt know it was an issue.

secondly even if you have a legitimate complaint, its still a complaint because you are complaining. so yes.. going to a grocery store and complaining about the spoiled milk you bought, which likely had the expiration date right on the front of it. is a complaint and whining. will they help you? yes, as long as it seems legitimate. whining by itself is not bad, its the lack of a legitimate reason. If i complain to add something to my car, with no expense to me for the reason of, "it would be cool to have" is a illegitimate reason. to which constructive feedback would tell me no. for x,y,z, and V reasons. the problem is people do not accept the reasons and still complain. example if you went to the store you would have to prove you just bought it. with your receipt, why? because it needs to be proven to be legitimate before you will get support. so until you can give reasons or proof its legitimate it is just whining.

[Gauntduo]

Yes it was voted worst company in AMERICA, I guess oil spills that killed wildlife and poluted a sea for years to come that was caused by cutting corners, and a bank illegaly foreclosing millions of homes so they could sell them faster is nothing compared to a "Bad game Launch" or "Mass Effect 3 crappy ending" that is my definition of whining. I simply would like research done first before exclaiming that someone or something isnt doing somthing. Like the interview I linked. anyway we can go back and forth on this all day. Lets be positive. Moving onto to bigger and brighter things.

[Bizniztyme]

Snip

It's not why they are doing what they are doing that makes them a whiner, it's how they are doing it, and alot of posts in these threads, i mean alot of them is certainly whining. There is nothing wrong with going to get a refund for spoiled milk but when you instead of going back to the store and saying you bought spoiled milk may I have a refund, that person goes in and demands a refund and ridicules said store for selling said milk, that's whining.

There is a civilized way of voicing your displeasure and then there are whiners, and from reading these forums, the latter is all over these forums.

And you gotta be kidding about someone who hates a game would just quit without saying anything right? I sure hope so!!!! Because that comment is so laughable.

Lastly, luxury of unwavering fealty from it's subjects? FFXIV was crucified for 1.0 in case you havent forgotten.

[Rydin]

Well they were not foreseeable

Because they don't have control over how many copies they sell?

Furthermore, if you don't like the food in a restaurant, you're not obligated to tell them what parts of it you didn't like or what ingredients could have made it better... I really think you're overstretching the obligations of the CONSUMER

Yes it was voted worst company in AMERICA, I guess oil spills that killed wildlife and poluted a sea for years to come that was caused by cutting corners, and a bank illegaly foreclosing millions of homes so they could sell them faster is nothing compared to a "Bad game Launch" or "Mass Effect 3 crappy ending" that is my definition of whining. I simply would like research done first before exclaiming that someone or something isnt doing somthing. Like the interview I linked. anyway we can go back and forth on this all day. Lets be positive. Moving onto to bigger and brighter things.

The problem is all of those other things had legal repercussions for them. And those companies suffered IMMENSELY for that. EA, on the other hand has not had to reap what they've sown. They do what they do oblivious to whats right and haven't had to own up to anything. In that regard, they ARE the worst company