A possible compromise between questing vs mob exp party grinding.

[Zehira]

I just want the 11 community back.

I don't... Imagine about Haruhi (even if you wanna hate her X3) you would hate me forever. That's why I like to create characters as many as I want to.

It's not gonna destroy the 11 community even if friends you met would add you to their friends list for you to remember who they are.

[SkyeWindbinder]

I don't... Imagine about Haruhi (even if you wanna hate her X3) you would hate me forever. That's why I like to create characters as many as I want to.

It's not gonna destroy the 11 community even if friends you met would add you to their friends list for you to remember who they are.

Well, you did it. You finally got me to google Haruhi, And now I'm hooked on a new anime. Well, I now know how I'm going to waste my Saturday morning. Thanks a bunch.

[ispano]

Well, you did it. You finally got me to google Haruhi, And now I'm hooked on a new anime. Well, I now know how I'm going to waste my Saturday morning. Thanks a bunch.

Just don't start dancing.

[Zehira]

Well, you did it. You finally got me to google Haruhi, And now I'm hooked on a new anime. Well, I now know how I'm going to waste my Saturday morning. Thanks a bunch.

No problem. ^_^;

I read Light Novels, it has more information about her than I watched that anime.

[Shurrikhan]

I don't think you understand the logical implications of buffing or nerfing "questing" and "grinding". Grinding is something everyone does regardless of what else they are doing with the game. It is literally impossible not to end up grinding monsters while questing or doing dungeons or whatever, so any kind of nerf to that is also a direct nerf to the other leveling methods.

The "solutions" offered by the party grind group are almost always "get rid of X, get rid of Y, without party grinding the MMO sucks".

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...l=1#post936713
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...l=1#post937500

You ever notice how the "quest leveling" people never ask for things like nerfing grinding, or that allowing grinding is going to kill the game, or whatever? And that the grind people freak out any time that YoshiP says anything about FATE/Quests/Leves/something-not-grinding?

Yeah, you guys are like white people complaining that you're being oppressed by minorities.

Unless the (stubbornly strong as in your above description) party-grind advocates were clearly in the majority, I don't get the simile.

I think the main reason though is that you can't really "go wrong" with grinding, probably because it's has nothing to it. Zero. It will only ever have what the players give it. Which then makes it highly individual, or because there are multiple individuals following some manner of unified actions over time, social. To be clear though, I don't really mean that in the positive sense alone. My point is the nothingness, which makes it the ultimate fall-back point. If you can enjoy yourself grinding, that says a lot about the combat and the community, frankly, two of the most fundamental basics of any MMO. If games can generally be broken into pillars of gameplay, story, and aesthetics, with the additional category of community or the like in MMOs, an enjoyable grinding experience is kind of like a proof of concept on two already.

For that reason, if quests are merely an outlet for gameplay (and outside of well written main quests, they are, merely, for gameplay), I'd prefer to start the pursuit of gameplay with grinding, and work my way up as is lucrative (not just conventional). A quest-grind solves nothing. It simply changes most of the much more variable-length, adaptable, party-useful, and skill-pursuable aspects of grinding into running and clicking. Refreshing at times, but less useful on the whole.

I don't mean to pretend that all this can successfully defend that viewpoint, but I do believe that this is where that view stems from. In short, it's a sort of fundamentalism that also lends itself towards adaptability by the players themselves.

[Yrusama]

I think my main fear is that the idea of a non-instanced dungeon is suddenly alien to SE. Whatever happened to going into a place like Mun-Tuy Cellars and farming steel ingots from skeletons? (I had a friend who did exactly that). What if you just want to enjoy the ambiance of being surrounded by ancient architecture so far removed from the light of day? Why must all dungeons be a quick in-and-out?

[fusional]

how about an option where i can just choose to be level 50 in any new class/job that gets released, since it doesn't take me longer than 30 minutes to learn how to play any of them?

[RowanLauron]

I think my main fear is that the idea of a non-instanced dungeon is suddenly alien to SE. Whatever happened to going into a place like Mun-Tuy Cellars and farming steel ingots from skeletons? (I had a friend who did exactly that). What if you just want to enjoy the ambiance of being surrounded by ancient architecture so far removed from the light of day? Why must all dungeons be a quick in-and-out?

Like I said in my original post, the newer generation of gamers have become the sort that want instant gratification and/or the most reward for the smallest effort in the least amount of time. Therefore MMO'S and console games alike have begun to adopt this philosophy. Unfortunately this is the path the gaming industry seems to be headed right now. I'm not sure if I like it too much, but I will cope with it for now. I still enjoy gaming too much

Or we are just getting lazy...there's a fine line I think...

[Jennika]

We are getting really close to Beta. Let's stop trying to "fix" the game before we even play it (I'm also guilty of this, so not singling anybody out).

I will admit that I have some fond memories grinding in FFXI, but those times are gone. If you level a new job in XI, you use Fields of Valor (like a leve that auto-repeats without you having to relog the quest) to 30 then pay gil to leech it to 99 in Abyssea while you afk. If you level if the old school way then you must like pain.

As for community, that will come from doing anything in groups and interacting with other people. It will just take time. I think also that the fact that we have one character also helps promote community as that one character will become your identity vs. having multiple characters with single classes.

[Laraul]

What's up with these discussions? Offering supposed solutions for problems they perceive somehow exists. What MMO forces you to grind any particular way? NONE. So please drop it.