Yoshi suggests playing WOW for a year

[Reika]

I wonder how many people bitched and moaned about XI being an EQ clone, but eventually got over it.

I will not miss party sitting in one area and tank pulling one monster at a time for slow boring combat either, ever.

[Zehira]

I wonder how many people bitched and moaned about XI being an EQ clone, but eventually got over it.

I didn't know FFXI was an EQ clone and didn't care.

[Zehira]

I will not miss party sitting in one area and tank pulling one monster at a time for slow boring combat either, ever.

Me too, I would love if FFXIV is like PSO where you kill enemies for xp before a boss for big xp.

[Gramul]

Yeah, standing around in the same place for hours at a time doing the exact same thing is so much better. Quest hubs are a good thing, I can't for the life of me understand why people hate them so much.

You misunderstand. I'm not exactly against quest hubs. I'm against bureaucratic systematized progression and the kill 10 X quests. I like the sound of that WoW quest you mentioned earlier in another thread. The one about sneaking around. But so many other MMO's take the same "influence" from WoW and end up doing this maneuver over and over instead of making quests interesting and allowing for more organic world based progression with high demand for community based play.

And so many other MMO's have these "standard features" already, I'm concerned that the games originality will be obscured by the fact and like those many other MMO's, fade into the void. Themepark MMO's are a dime a dozen these days and it's pretty clear that customers aren't all that interested beyond initial hype. Even when Star Wars added a strong narrative it wasn't enough to hold interest for terribly long. That being said the 'failure' of that game could also stem from a lack of endgame content and abysmal customer support than just being the same thing with more new features and a coat of Well Recognized and Popular Theme Paint.

I just think they could have explored the sandbox idea more instead of scrapping it for the 'sure thing'. And who knows, maybe it won't be a complete abandonment of those ideas either. I'm more than willing to try the game out first and see how I like it.

[Reika]

You misunderstand. I'm not exactly against quest hubs. I'm against bureaucratic systematized progression and the kill 10 X quests. I like the sound of that WoW quest you mentioned earlier in another thread. The one about sneaking around. But so many other MMO's take the same "influence" from WoW and end up doing this maneuver over and over instead of making quests interesting and allowing for more organic world based progression with high demand for community based play.

And so many other MMO's have these "standard features" already, I'm concerned that the games originality will be obscured by the fact and like those many other MMO's, fade into obscurity. Themepark MMO's are a dime a dozen these days and it's pretty clear that customers aren't all that interested beyond initial hype. Even when Star Wars added a strong narrative it wasn't enough to hold interest for terribly long. That being said the 'failure' of that game could also stem from a lack of endgame content and abysmal customer support than just being the same thing with more new features and a coat of Well Recognized and Popular Theme Paint.

I just think they could have explored the sandbox idea more instead of scrapping it for the 'sure thing'. And who knows, maybe it won't be a complete abandonment of those ideas either. I'm more than willing to try the game out first and see how I like it.

I think SE would do better, as quests in 1.0 already featured you doing different things than just killing X amount of things then returning. Like dancing around in a subligar at the docks to make fish happy.

[Gramul]

I think SE would do better, as quests in 1.0 already featured you doing different things than just killing X amount of things then returning. Like dancing around in a subligar at the docks to make fish happy.

I think I missed that one. I'm just remembering all those terribly dull guildleves.

[KiriA500]

You misunderstand. I'm not exactly against quest hubs. I'm against bureaucratic systematized progression and the kill 10 X quests. I like the sound of that WoW quest you mentioned earlier in another thread. The one about sneaking around. But so many other MMO's take the same "influence" from WoW and end up doing this maneuver over and over instead of making quests interesting and allowing for more organic world based progression with high demand for community based play.

And so many other MMO's have these "standard features" already, I'm concerned that the games originality will be obscured by the fact and like those many other MMO's, fade into obscurity. Themepark MMO's are a dime a dozen these days and it's pretty clear that customers aren't all that interested beyond initial hype. Even when Star Wars added a strong narrative it wasn't enough to hold interest for terribly long. That being said the 'failure' of that game could also stem from a lack of endgame content and abysmal customer support than just being the same thing with more new features and a coat of Well Recognized and Popular Theme Paint.

I just think they could have explored the sandbox idea more instead of scrapping it for the 'sure thing'. And who knows, maybe it won't be a complete abandonment of those ideas either. I'm more than willing to try the game out first and see how I like it.

Even that quest I mentioned, it still had the standard "quest archetype."

-Gather 10 leaves
-Gather 10 piles of fox poop (yes, lol, fox poop!)
-Kill 10 dudes to get some item
-Get key from main boss
-Funny fifth thing

The thing is, it's how it's given to us that makes it interesting. The thing I absolutely love about World of Warcraft over Final Fantasy XI/XIV is the feeling that you aren't just immediately the hero of the universe. You're always a small cog in a small thing, that ultimately leads up to something much bigger. The quest I mention was basically me rescuing a bunch of dudes from the Horde, who then want to get revenge, so we destroy their stuff. At the end, a dragon is summoned, and everyone but me died. I got to go on and give the bad news that the entire team didn't make it.

I enjoy that MUCH more than what we had in Final Fantasy XIV. You're a guy with a power like everyone else. Snore.

I really hope the questing system in A Realm Reborn makes me have the feeling I do in World of Warcraft. That this world isn't just one gigantic disaster. Having smaller quests you can get involved in is nice. We had stuff like that with the class quests in 1.0, but those were so spread out, and hardly worth the effort unless you were into story. I want the entire game to play out like I'm a nobody working my way to the top, not just a nobody who is already there.

[Gramul]

Even that quest I mentioned, it still had the standard "quest archetype."

-Gather 10 leaves
-Gather 10 piles of fox poop (yes, lol, fox poop!)
-Kill 10 dudes to get some item
-Get key from main boss
-Funny fifth thing

The thing is, it's how it's given to us that makes it interesting. The thing I absolutely love about World of Warcraft over Final Fantasy XI/XIV is the feeling that you aren't just immediately the hero of the universe. You're always a small cog in a small thing, that ultimately leads up to something much bigger. The quest I mention was basically me rescuing a bunch of dudes from the Horde, who then want to get revenge, so we destroy their stuff. At the end, a dragon is summoned, and everyone but me died. I got to go on and give the bad news that the entire team didn't make it.

I enjoy that MUCH more than what we had in Final Fantasy XIV. You're a guy with a power like everyone else. Snore.

I really hope the questing system in A Realm Reborn makes me have the feeling I do in World of Warcraft. That this world isn't just one gigantic disaster. Having smaller quests you can get involved in is nice. We had stuff like that with the class quests in 1.0, but those were so spread out, and hardly worth the effort unless you were into story. I want the entire game to play out like I'm a nobody working my way to the top, not just a nobody who is already there.

I'm all too happy to have quests with interesting plot and structure like that, but I'm not interested in following the mechanic structure over and over.


Just using XI as an example sense I have an old guide next to me, there's all sort of kinds of quests. An escort quest where you can't let the guy see you. A quest where you have to dress up just right for a young fashionista. A quest where you have to run around town in a hat as advertisement for a shop. A quest where you have to sneak through a maze of high level enemies to get a sample of geyser water by letting yourself get sprayed by it.

Yeah keep the story and presentation interesting, but don't restrict the gameplay to a system you made specifically for it. Keep it open and dynamic.

As for being a part of the whole vs being an individual hero of the story. I guess that's really a matter of personal taste. I personally find the part of a whole thing to be kinda unfulfilling most of the time.


Bonus comic!

[Kallera]

Soooo.. Word has begun to slip out from Alpha, I am not personally in it so I don't actually know, and it seems the verdict is; WoW Clone.

Full on WoW Clone.

Not going to site links. Don't really want to get people in trouble.

Its already too late for Naoki Yoshida.

Assuming this is true.

[Valmonte]

Fixed. Don't even fucking try telling me that I'm wrong either. Because you try being a Dragoon before Abyssea. Try being a Red Mage after Abyssea. Try doing content in FFXI now without having an Empyrean. Hell, try shouting for assistance on a mission or a quest. At least in XIV you'll get more than one person to try to join you.

If FFXIV is full of elitism and piss poor attitudes, XI is 10x worse.

i was a Dragoon before abyssea and i have no idea what your on about. PLD/75 SAM/75 and DRG/67 were my three highest classes when i quit the game shortly after WoTG. not liking where the game was heading was one of my biggest reasons for leaving.

not all experiences are the same, ive heard that odin an ifrit were some of the worst servers community wise and very elitist.

XI was elitist out of necessity you either sucked or you didn't, people were more than happy to show you the ropes and if you did good invite you to an SEA/SKY/DYN LS, having the best possible gear actually meant something in XI and wasn't just a status symbol.

XiV is elitist by community, where your either Kissing your LS leaders ass or you find yourself out of the loop, hardly anyone will take time out of there little Clik for the new guy show him what needs to be done and for some odd reason people are obsessed with having only the best possible geared players for stats that have minimal returns.

XiV didn't have to be that Way, it was made that Way.