[Speculation Discussion] Our Primal

[Warlock]

If it was Bahamut talking through Darnus in "to kill a Raven" he agrees completely in the concept of the world been cleaned up...so maybe that is why he retires and the world manages to be rebuilt in 5 years because he feels the cleaning has been done? i would hope that he nearly annihilated the Garlemalds same as how he attacked Limsa, besides they are the ones that took down one of Bahamut's strongest servants and possibly a good friend Midgarsormr.

What will be the Empire's reaction to Bahamut? he can't and wont be tamed he is a danger for them as it is for every living thing in the planet. I think the Empire will launch an attack to fight him and tire him up i don't know what you guys think?

EDIT:I just noticed too after watching again all the CGI trailers for ARR that Bahamut is wearing a golden armor and Odin wears armor too so i assume Elder Primals wear heavy armor?

[KaMuiSouZou]

Ascilia's father (Warburton) had important information about the Garleans and Ala Mhigo. Corguevais tells Ascilia that Niellefresne had planned the Goobbue escape in order to gain ground with the people, but Warburton was an accidental death. You learn all this from Thancred and his poker bet in the Platinum Mirage. They were going to attempt to use Necromancy to bring back Warburton so they could hear what he had to tell, but then Niellefresne was stabbed from behind. You witness it happen by using The Echo through Ascilia that shows Mumuep and Niellefresne opening her father's tomb so we can only suspect that she stabbed him.

Ah, I didn't know Warburton's info was specifically about the Garlean Empire/Ala Mhigo. Out of curiousity when was it explained, because I don't see that info in Golden Sacrifices?

As far as I know, we have no idea who actually stabbed Niellefresne? When you say "we can only suspect that she stabbed him" I'm assuming you mean the owner of the Goldsmith's guild? (is the owner female?). I don't know the full extent of the Goldsmith class story (only did the first quest) but I doubt the actual owner was the one who did the stabbing (the character model seems to be male as well). But again I'm wondering how much it ties into the main story, as opposed to just being part of the goldsmith class quest line.

[RoxyLalonde]

If it was Bahamut talking through Darnus in "to kill a Raven" he agrees completely in the concept of the world been cleaned up...so maybe that is why he retires and the world manages to be rebuilt in 5 years because he feels the cleaning has been done? i would hope that he nearly annihilated the Garlemalds same as how he attacked Limsa, besides they are the ones that took down one of Bahamut's strongest servants and possibly a good friend Midgarsormr.

What will be the Empire's reaction to Bahamut? he can't and wont be tamed he is a danger for them as it is for every living thing in the planet. I think the Empire will launch an attack to fight him and tire him up i don't know what you guys think?

EDIT:I just noticed too after watching again all the CGI trailers for ARR that Bahamut is wearing a golden armor and Odin wears armor too so i assume Elder Primals wear heavy armor?

that would mean he hates the lesser primals too interesting

[NoloeTazier]

Ah, I didn't know Warburton's info was specifically about the Garlean Empire/Ala Mhigo. Out of curiousity when was it explained, because I don't see that info in Golden Sacrifices?

As far as I know, we have no idea who actually stabbed Niellefresne? When you say "we can only suspect that she stabbed him" I'm assuming you mean the owner of the Goldsmith's guild? (is the owner female?). I don't know the full extent of the Goldsmith class story (only did the first quest) but I doubt the actual owner was the one who did the stabbing (the character model seems to be male as well). But again I'm wondering how much it ties into the main story, as opposed to just being part of the goldsmith class quest line.

I mean Ascilia stabbed him, you go with F'lhaminn(think thats her name) and you discover Ascilia laying on the floor of the tomb and she's shaking scared, that's when you use The Echo. This is all main storyline. Goldsmith quest I don't remember it going into anything too deep (seems like the quests take place WELL after the main storyline) just that Colbernoux seemed to love F'lhaminn like his brother did. After the what? 4 main storyline quests? I don't remember anymore about Corguevais and Ascilia after. Things kicked off the Path of the Twelve quests, maybe there was nothing more to the story that we wouldn't find out from Minfilia.

[Rassa]

Ah yes, what/whoever our primal is, we should probably assume it pre-dates The Twelve. After all, if the 5 races are all worshiping The Twelve, that would kind of imply we all converted at some point. The question then would be, are there 5 forgotten primals, one for each race? Primals that we all abandoned? Or 1 primal that we all share (which would mean that we are all descended from a common ancestor... right?)?

In the Ul'dah storyline there are tons of references to relationships/marriages between members of different races, and it is treated as totally normal. From this I assumed that all 5 races are the same SPECIES, which would suggest one primal.

[Catapult]

The idea of Siren... it's just too mundane. There is already too much lore about the "sirens" running around for it to be the answer here, especially since all of that lore revolves around Limsa.

"The paragon warned me of the godless blessed."
If the "primal" Siren was indeed messing with us, the we would not be the godless blessed.

I'm going to propose an alternate theory: The Lodestone.
The crystal, heart and source of the aether, has woken us to protect her. Just like in many of the earlier FF games, notably III and V.

The second ARR trailer (the one made for fans, not the hollywood one) tells us to "heed the crystal's call."

EDIT: Dropping this screencap here.

[Endu]

While I doubt it is the case, you have to remember, this is all belief in world; lore and mythology. It's entirely possible that what is taught about the 12 is a complete fabrication. That being said, in principle I agree with you, usually lore in Final Fantasy games is set in stone and taken at face value.

Final Fantasy 11 had all kinds of twists in the main storylines of the 3 main expansions. I wouldn't count on the lore ever being the concrete factual truth, ESPECIALLY when it concerns gods & goddesses. FFXI flipped the script multiple times with the lore, I wouldn't be surprised if FFXIV did the same.

[Anonymoose]

<Snip>

I like where you're going with a lot of this - and it's certainly up to date with the research I've been doing myself. I think your point about the importance of the Primals vs. Ascians. vs. Woken match is right on, and maybe even opens the door for what we see. The ascian in the Limsa Lominsa storyline wanted the key personally and is visibly a cause of the star showers and possibly even time travel. It would be very interesting if the ascians were the cause of our echo - even indirectly, as if seeing the threat of the ascians roused a primal to pick us as their defense against them.

Amaal'jaa are fire. If Goblins are racially different from Kobolds they might have another elemental affinity, otherwise I'd probably lump them in with Kobolds as being Earth based.

The goblins are most definitely a unique race - but if we see their primal, I'm betting (like the moogles) it will be something semi-canon; a fun distraction. Goblins are supposed to be ambiguous - we never see their true faces (though, if you do a little subtraction theory on their various masks, you come to something that looks a bit a specific version of the XI concept art, though less scraggly), sometimes they're friends, sometimes they're foes... For them to summon a powerful, legitimate primal would give them too much of a polarized identity.

The same with the qiqirn, methinks. The Aht Urhgan expansion was basically a middle eastern doppelganger of everything we already knew, and the qiqirn were the goblins of that doubling.

Therefore, it makes sense that, even though they'd need a main element simply for the fact we have to fight some of them and they need to have drops, that they wouldn't take up one of the key slots on the wheel.

The sylph, however, are new. In past Final Fantasies, sylph were very similar to pixies - but here we see them with a new visage (possibly to leave the door open for "XI-Legitimate" pixies later on). They have no ties to ambiguity, are part of the main story, and can fall from grace without messing up how we look at the world.

I wonder if they will take Alexander and make it so it's a machine fortress created by the Garleans infused with the spirit of a Primal so that they can fully control it.

I've got this tingling in the back of my brain that says something very similar to this... Garleans... secret primal... possibly Alexander... I like where you're going with this. [MOOSE APPROVED STAMP]

In the Ul'dah storyline there are tons of references to relationships/marriages between members of different races, and it is treated as totally normal. From this I assumed that all 5 races are the same SPECIES, which would suggest one primal.

That's an interesting way to look at it - humans sure don't all look the same, after all. I mean, none of our historically bottle-necked species have grown tails or horns yet (sadly), but there are sure variations in skin, features, and overall fuzziness (lolmiqo'te). I think you're onto something - one species, many different isolated adaptations.

If the "primal" Siren was indeed messing with us, the we would not be the godless blessed. I'm going to propose an alternate theory: The Lodestone.

There are many ways to take the former sentence, but I like the theory of the latter. I'm going to add that one to the list. The voice-over you hear during the crystal scene sounds a lot like the voice during the awakening, as well. Good theory, sir!

[Alaltus]

That's an interesting way to look at it - humans sure don't all look the same, after all. I mean, none of our historically bottle-necked species have grown tails or horns yet (sadly), but there are sure variations in skin, features, and overall fuzziness (lolmiqo'te). I think you're onto something - one species, many different isolated adaptations.

Ofcourse as it states in the book of Lala that in the beginning there were only Lala and then some other Lala who split off from the group devolved into less superiorly sized beings. It all fits! =P

[Warlock]

It will be interesting to see which side the new Primals choose Siren,Fenrir,Leviathan,Shiva,Cait Sith and Odin.Will they be against Bahamut? or they will serve him?

I would love to know if Yoshi-P has a set number of Primes he will add or the list will keep getting bigger