If someone makes a deadly boss mods type addon for ARR would you use it?

[Preypacer]

Once you've beaten something, that initial woopty-do rush is over and it boils down to farming. Once that happens yeah people don't want to spend the hours they initially did relearning over and over with new and half assed setups. They want to get in there, get shit done as efficiently as possible, and get out.

That applies with or without mods, I thought this was obvious to anyone that's raided for any length of time.

Except that those mods and addons (and so on) are mandatory by many raiding guilds for even the first attempt up to and including the win. It's not a "farm status" thing. It's a " first attempt and every one after" situation.

I've been in several such guilds and have known people in many more such guilds. I have never known of a guild who only used them for farming the raids.

I quite clearly remember being told that, without exception, everyone *had* to have a specific list of add-ons installed for the first attempt of a raid, else they didn't go. In one guild you had to post a screenshot to prove you had the "required setup". Everyone was also required to read the strategy and have it open on their computer or on a hand-held if possible.

I've been around the MMO block a few too many times to believe it's "farming only".

People rely on add-ons as a crutch because they want the win to be as easy as possible, with as little personal effort as possible. They are not ever necessary.

[Madruk]

XIV-only players never raided. So it's not obvious for people in here

The point of wanting to get things done efficiently still stands in XIV, even more so because of the retarded way loot drops are designed. Would you rather do 500 15 min dungeon runs or 500 45 minute ones? I know the answer most would pick. Is that being lazy? Nope, that's making efficient use of your time.

People rely on add-ons as a crutch because they want the win to be as easy as possible, with as little personal effort as possible. They are not ever necessary.

You can't really blame the player, blame the games design. Like mentioned above alot of WoW's raid game was designed with the mods in mind. I'm not a huge advocate of covering your entire screen with mods so that you're basically playing whack-a-mole, but lumping everyone together as lazy or incompetent because the game itself requires you to use them to progress is pointless. WoW is pretty much the only game I raided where mod's were an essential requirement.

[Deakka]

Except that those mods and addons (and so on) are mandatory by many raiding guilds for even the first attempt up to and including the win. It's not a "farm status" thing. It's a " first attempt and every one after" situation.

I've been in several such guilds and have known people in many more such guilds. I have never known of a guild who only used them for farming the raids.

I quite clearly remember being told that, without exception, everyone *had* to have a specific list of add-ons installed for the first attempt of a raid, else they didn't go. In one guild you had to post a screenshot to prove you had the "required setup". Everyone was also required to read the strategy and have it open on their computer or on a hand-held if possible.

I've been around the MMO block a few too many times to believe it's "farming only".

People rely on add-ons as a crutch because they want the win to be as easy as possible, with as little personal effort as possible. They are not ever necessary.

If you've been around the block a few times, then you know this is "par for the course" in a raiding guild. While it's a bit more extreme than most (most would simply use tools within the specific addon to see who is running it and whose version is out of date. Screenshots are a bit excessive), you knowingly signed up for it. If you prefer to be a purist, create your own guild that does the opposite. Just realize you're going to be ridiculed if you attempt to throw out the "l3373r than thou" attitude among bleeding edge raiders.

By the way, I'd love to hear your vent/mumble during a boss attempt. Apparently it would be silent as a lamb with all the pro players. If it's like any normal ls, it's full of "Holy fuck move", "That's bullshit, I totally moved", "Argh, I herped, sorry", and "DEAR GOD WHY AREN'T YOU MOVING OUT OF THE WAY". All DBM does is save the raid leader's voice during progression attempts, or rather, reduce the strain (from personal experience, there will always be "that guy" who will do the exact opposite of his role in a fight, no matter what.... from here to eternity).