I wouldn't mind FFXIV becoming a WoW clone in the casual/hardcore appeal if...

[Exn]

can you show me where anyone did that? can you do that? if you could do that i would be chuffed as nuts.

don't know who you are, and i don't particularly care. but if WoW endgame was such a breeze, feel free to post your armory. surely it will be loaded with difficult time-relevant (ie: not going back to faceroll through level 80 content at level 85 for a mount you weren't good enough to earn when it was actually hard) raid achievements. surely.

Yeah, expected a response like this from you... If you don't care who I am, then you shouldn't ask who I am. Obviously, you do.. Me on the other hand, could genuinely careless who you are/were.. as I'm speaking from experience and don't need anyone to tell me what I already know... In any event, since you asked... my WoW toons are old as dirt but feel free to look them up since you care so much.. I can't post links from work (can't even access wow site).. Lightning Blade (Druid - Chimlon; DK - Inknik; Warlock -Fumumalu). Also had a cupl 80's on alliance side (but so did everybody... as I said... cakewalk for alot of ppl...).

No need to write a wall-o-txt reply to this, like you just did with that other guy.. I heard your opinion on the matter.. and moved on.. to each his/her own.

Yo Cid, wtf is a "Starlord"...

[XxOstiaxX]

People always throw around WoW's numbers yet never state the fact Blizzard counts inactive, banned and canceled accounts in their total numbers too -- Sub number doesn't mean a game is good because Maplestory is one of the most played MMOs in existence and we can debate whether it's good or not and pre or post Big Bang.

People always throw "Facts out of their ass" when they have no idea as to what the hell they are talking about... Because you know WOW uses inactive subs towards their total current subs.... OH WAIT!! They dont lol

[Jeronlmo]

The idea of an achievement for doing "extra", or something that doesnt need to be done bothers me, like your AV example, i never get food, not because of the achieve, but because its faster, w/e the hardest/most effective thing is, that should just be what you have to do, just not a fan that people do less and win.

[XxOstiaxX]

Yo Cid, wtf is a "Starlord"...

When you prove something and the person being called out or proven wrong usually uses one of the following excuses:

"That is subjective"

"You are wrong because "Mysterious reasons"

"You are right, but fuck it i am a fanboy"

[XxOstiaxX]

Anyways, whats the drama with achievements ? If i recall correctly most are worthless anyways, the only really worthwhile ones where the hardmode ones and arenas anyways <.<

[Jeronlmo]

Basically they asked someone to post a link to their very old WoW chars, they did, and then bashed them for not having certain achievements.

[fusional]

Yo Cid, wtf is a "Starlord"...

so you conveniently missed this part directly after

maybe you should read it. you might learn a thing or two. but otherwise, you're right. no need for a wall of text here. no alone in the darkness achievement (not even three lights? come on) for 10 or 25, no firefighter for 10 or 25- not even any observed achievement for 10 or 25. if WoW was so easy, why didn't you breeze through these?

but no, you're right. kiting kirin around some pillars for half an hour is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay harder. my mistake.

which is important for several reasons, but namely-

thinking kara or gruul's or blackwing descent are equivalent to "WoW endgame" is tantamount to calling ifrit (hard) XIV endgame, or sky triggers XI endgame. you've only scratched the surface, and assuming everything from that point on is no different is absolutely foolish.

i spent 6 years grinding FFXI endgame, and i laugh at the stuff people say in these threads because 99.9% of them would've been absolutely eaten alive by Firefighter, Alone in the Darkness, pre-nerf Vashj, nearly anything in Sunwell (twins anyone?)...

it took the most elite players in the world weeks/months to even make progress on a lot of those bosses/achievements, much less beat them. meanwhile people were clearing Bahamut V.2 in a few days... clearing garuda and van darnus (hard) in a day or two, clearing ifrit extreme in a week...

don't get me wrong, i enjoy the fact that yoshi and co. are trying to give us some bigger challenges (they've really done well with rivenroad hard, considering the limitations of this client/engine), but the fact that people on these very forums are complaining about these being extremely difficult or even nearly impossible while saying WoW is super easy...

just lollllll

so. what's happening here is i keep referencing these specific encounters, right? and i'm doing it for a reason. and because you're being a moron, i apparently need to explain this very carefully to you. i'll even type it in capitals.

NOT ALL CONTENT IS CREATED EQUAL.

comprende?

so here you have me referencing specific bosses from specific raids, specific achievements tied to those bosses- and i ask someone if they've done these. i challenge them, if WoW is soooooo easy, to show me they've completed stuff that is actually considered hard in that game. because then if they've done it, and they had an easy time of it, calling all of WoW's endgame easy would carry a bit more weight, yeah?

and what happened was- they posted their character names, and upon searching them on the armory you can very quickly and easily see that they, in fact, *did not* clear this difficult content. they very clearly were a casual-to-midcore player who predominantly did some heroic grinding for wellfare epics then filled in the gaps in their gear with easy to get stuff from bosses people *pugged* in that game.

what does this mean?

they only served to prove me right.

why is this funny? because you know *so little* about the game in question that you think their proof is actually proof, without having any understanding of it and without actually looking it over and vetting it whatsoever.

and then when i reiterate my unchallenged position, you've the audacity to claim i dodged?

do you have any idea at all what's going on here, or anywhere for that matter? who are you and what have you done? surely you'll stop and ask me why that's important, and this is my answer:

because if you've done nothing, then there's a higher likelihood of you understanding nothing. if you understand nothing, you lack perspective and experience to give your arguments clout. if you make arguments lacking clout, i have absolutely no reason at all to take anything you say seriously.

now if you want me to take you seriously, how about doing that thing i keep asking about- providing proof. provide proof of your accomplishments in MMOs. show us what you've experienced, help us understand your perspective. give us an idea of how much weight your arguments carry.

because otherwise you're just spewing a bunch of baseless crap like the people you're blindly waving your flag for.

savvy?

[Priya]

Anyways, whats the drama with achievements ? If i recall correctly most are worthless anyways, the only really worthwhile ones where the hardmode ones and arenas anyways <.<

They were brought up because they can be used as time-stamped proof that you actually cleared content. Granted, it doesn't quite work if you go back to before they were implemented or if a character has been inactive for a very long time, but generally the latter is more of an issue than the former.

You're driving the point home by pointing out the ones that were harder to achieve. Thank you for that.

[fusional]

anyway, this entire thread is an exercise in futility. the anti-WoW crowd here as a general rule has no interest in objectivity, facts, or rationale. they're just here to endlessly beat their chests about a game they either never experienced, or only experienced limited segments of. (which is, again, no different from the anti-FFXI or anti-XXXX crowds over on the WoW forums...)

and you know what? that's fine if you didn't clear everything in the game. totally fine.

but the point is- if you haven't, don't comment on it. you have no leg to stand on. you want to talk about what kind of content is difficult and what isn't? cool, but go clear garuda first. she's the *furthest* thing from difficult, but it's a start.

and then you can go work on Rivenroad (hard). which actually is fairly hard compared to other stuff in *this* game (and harder than most stuff in XI). but compared to the specific achievements/bosses i referenced when talking about difficult stuff in WoW- Rivenroad (hard) is a walk in the park.

and if you can't even beat Rivenroad (hard), how exactly am i supposed to take you seriously when you see me reference *actually* difficult things like Firefighter and Alone in the Darkness and tell me they must be super easy because you pugged flame leviathan?

get out of here.

[Exn]

so you conveniently missed this part directly after

No, it was actually "you that conveniently missed this part directly after"

Yo, not everyone was an achievement whore like you? (Well assuming you yourself pursued such acheivements, cause if not, then wtf are you even talking about...). Clearly Inkie was highly versed in WoW endgame.. and WoW in general, yet still here you go w/ more excuses... And kiting kirin around pillars... REALLY? That was the best you could come up with? You sir, are indeed a joke(in regards to this thread at least). OK, carry on WoWhead..

Ahhh yea, see what I did there^^

NOT ALL CONTENT IS CREATED EQUAL.

Guys, I think this guy deserves a prize.. Congratulations on your revelation, really. I think the rest of us likely realized that when first demoing the new Pong on Atari, but nonetheless I'm glad you finally caught up..

Ok, at the point you asked if I understand that fundamental concept, in Spanish... I stopped reading, gotta be honest. The rest of what you posted could be very inspirational and enlightening, or could be more of the same defensive pandering dodging the fact that someone showed you your 'proof', as you requested, with a valid opinion that counters your own.. you simply can't just leave it at that. I'mmmm betting more of the same so, I dunno, you win?