Wait a sec... Let me get this straight...

[SwordCoheir]

Not sure about how FFXI was. But for FFXIV the reason for the QQing was because PLD was more difficult to use as a tank. Most of the compaining seemed to come from Warriors that were trying out Paladin. They realized that Warrior as it was, was so much easier to Tank with, and due to the complaining of it "sucking", many decent Paladins were left out of parties.

Now with the adjustments, forums, and practice, people are realizing Paladin and Warrior are both effective, and each slightly better in their own situations.

The complaining stems from good Paladins getting shafted in parties because of the mindset that Paladin sucks. Which is perfectly understandable, because why would a PUG take a chance that a PLD may not be good, when 9/10 WAR's get the job done.

I'm glad that's all in the wind now.

Agreed, as others have said WAR being able to heavily DD multiple mobs at once and Tank simultaneously while PLD is pretty much reduced medicore DD while only being able to tank one mob reliably put PLD in a lopsided disadvantage when it came to being picked for dodgeball.

In either case since they've upped PLD's single target DPS, fixed Shields, and separated WAR's tank and DD roles a bit more clearly there's a greater decision on which is better depending on the situation, and in many cases both are usable in most endgame situations now.

[Aceofspades]

Oh no not you too. You would have a point if I was commenting on the class/job itself and not certain players who play the class instead. I wasn't so you don't. In my original post I never said whether I agreed or disagreed with Burrito Slicer's complaint about Warrior. I'm talking about seeing paladins complain for years and years and you're acting like I'm trying to discuss the finer points of tanking. The only thing leveling the class would do in this particular situation is maybe give me more insight on why people are crybabies in the first place. That was the reason I posted the question in the first place. What's going to happen now? You two are going to type at me at all caps?

I find it humorous that you don't see the logic in knowing what your talking about, and then complaining about "people complaining" You want to know why PLDs on ffxiv are complaining yet you never lvled the class? wich , from your first post dosent seem like that was even the question you were asking. It apeared as tho you were complaining yourself, about how you feel SE gimped war and seem to place the blame on PLDs "crying" on the forums, yet the whole time SE intended to change WAR simply because it was OP, and for SE to admit that a job is OP means alot. Soo in response to your blatenly obvious atempt to deflect your moronic motive for this thread, I have only to say, if you wanted to know why SE "gimped" war, then you missed out on your chance to find that out when you didn't lvl either war or pld. Dont blame others because you feel SE made unfair changes to a job or class you feel was undeserved of changes. No amounts of crying done on the forums will change aspects crucial to job balance within the game. Yoshi has a mind for these kinds of things and Im certain he can figure it out and make the decisions without anyones crying, including yours. What did you think you were going to acomplish? "yoshi, you changed wars because of cry babbies, and soo now im gona cry on forums soo you will change it back" , somthing like that? First thing you need to do before you start posting is getting a clue.

[Searious]

Not sure about how FFXI was. But for FFXIV the reason for the QQing was because PLD was more difficult to use as a tank. Most of the complaining seemed to come from Warriors that were trying out Paladin. They realized that Warrior as it was, was so much easier to Tank with, and due to the complaining of it "sucking", many decent Paladins were left out of parties.

Now with the adjustments, forums, and practice, people are realizing Paladin and Warrior are both effective, and each slightly better in their own situations.

The complaining stems from good Paladins getting shafted in parties because of the mindset that Paladin sucks. Which is perfectly understandable, because why would a PUG take a chance that a PLD may not be good, when 9/10 WAR's get the job done.

I'm glad that's all in the wind now.

Thank you for explaining that for me.

[Searious]

I find it humorous that you don't see the logic in knowing what your talking about, and then complaining about "people complaining" You want to know why PLDs on ffxiv are complaining yet you never lvled the class? wich , from your first post dosent seem like that was even the question you were asking. It apeared as tho you were complaining yourself, about how you feel SE gimped war and seem to place the blame on PLDs "crying" on the forums, yet the whole time SE intended to change WAR simply because it was OP, and for SE to admit that a job is OP means alot. Soo in response to your blatenly obvious atempt to deflect your moronic motive for this thread, I have only to say, if you wanted to know why SE "gimped" war, then you missed out on your chance to find that out when you didn't lvl either war or pld. Dont blame others because you feel SE made unfair changes to a job or class you feel was undeserved of changes. No amounts of crying done on the forums will change aspects crucial to job balance within the game. Yoshi has a mind for these kinds of things and Im certain he can figure it out and make the decisions without anyones crying, including yours. What did you think you were going to acomplish? "yoshi, you changed wars because of cry babbies, and soo now im gona cry on forums soo you will change it back" , somthing like that? First thing you need to do before you start posting is getting a clue.

First line of my first post specifically asked that question so I don't know what you were reading. It's not my fault if you got your feelings hurt and read more into what was actually there. Anyway if you don't know the difference between commenting on players vs commenting on gameplay itself there's not much I can do for you. I was commenting on Paladin players in THIS game AND FFXI. Both complained about the alt tanking classes in BOTH games. I wasn't deflecting anything. I was attempting to explain to you the bearing playing a tanking class and not playing a tanking class has. You don't need to play the class to notice players complaining. Playing the class might only help you see WHY they're complaining. I already now why the
plds were crying in FFXI. I see this thread and it's like "Here we go again." Apparently that went over your head.

[Aceofspades]

First line of my first post specifically asked that question so I don't know what you were reading. It's not my fault if you got your feelings hurt and read more into what was actually there. Anyway if you don't know the difference between commenting on players vs commenting on gameplay itself there's not much I can do for you. I was commenting on Paladin players in THIS game AND FFXI. Both complained about the alt tanking classes in BOTH games. I wasn't deflecting anything. I was attempting to explain to you the bearing playing a tanking class and not playing a tanking class has. You don't need to play the class to notice players complaining. Playing the class might only help you see WHY they're complaining. I already now why the
plds were crying in FFXI. I see this thread and it's like "Here we go again." Apparently that went over your head.

.... you ask us if we read what you write, but do YOU read what you write? you make no sense. "I dont have 50 war or pld, but I dont know why plds cry about war, even tho i know nothing about the class but im gona talk about em like I actually know what im talking about". Im done with you, im debating nothing over somone with no real opinion about anything of value. you like to be critical but have no insentive to actually try to figure shit out. When you have constructive critisim then you will be warented a response

[Searious]

I do know what I'm talking about. I'm only talking about post people make online. Not the job itself. It's not that deep. I'm sorry I hurt your feelings.

[Kagato]

[Molly_Millions]

there's a lot of butthurt going on in this thread. More test results, less QQ!

[Aceofspades]

Why are plds always such crybabies when there's another tank alternative? When every there's another tank you can be sure Paladins will be crying for them to be nerfed. Even in FF11. "Oh Noes ppl r inviting Ninjas! It take more than 5 mins to get a prty invite now.

your original statement, only thing that resembles a question was the first part , wich is obviously retorical, you made a statement in wich you didnt know what you were talking about.

They really threw the balance off with the update, I tank as both pld and war in av/cc. Pld is just more practical for bad players now in place of "old war" while "new war" takes some real attention/work/tp conserving for bosses to hold aggro off of serious dps on miser/chim/garuda without using collusions and your own dmg/enmity moves correctly. I think they should have left the uptime on rampage alone and made steel cyclone more effective the less mobs you have so war's single target tanking didn't make it completely obvious that this game hates war tanks.

In general, buffing pld up and some minor nerfs to war might have balanced things out correctly but now it's a real pain. I use pld for chim now to give whms a break and blms more nuking room.

This is where it all orginated, and it was this persons opinion that sparked.....

Because we want SE to make Warrior deal insane damage and tank well with very little effort... Great idea bro. Paladin also got a bit of a buff with the changes, it's just that Warrior is still an easy class to tank as, it is sickening. I feel things are just about right, with the exception of the miss rate melee classes have to deal with.

Let's just put the warrior job in it's place as a trash mob/secondary tank and we'll have more variety in dungeon runs. I might sound a bit harsh.. but it's only because I'm very sensitive about this subject.

this response, now up till this point everyone had an idea of what they were saying , untill you posted. Everyone is entitiled to their opinion but yours was completely biased and un based on anything you knew.

I do know what I'm talking about. I'm only talking about post people make online. Not the job itself. It's not that deep. I'm sorry I hurt your feelings.

wich makes this post complete bull, you should be a politian, or , on second thought we have enough of em with your mindset.

[GreyJorildyn]

I'm pretty sure opinions are purely based on what people know, regardless of bias.

Maybe we should all ignore Ace henceforth.