Why is the FFXIV fanbase so stubborn and resistant to change?

[Betelgeuzah]

Okay, are you 'spamming' the basic attack? How about designing encounters that require more than just spamming basic attack to defeat the monsters? I mean, if the content does not encourage the usage of other skills, people are not going to use them. Further, even with auto-attack, you would only use other skills because you are so bored out of your mind- the content is still as easy and boring as ever.

There is too much input lag- improve the server hardware and code?

Can't chat? Voice chat + something like FFXIII's queued attacks does the job.

Sucks to go back to action 1 when playing with a pad? Make the action bar more suited for gamepads (3x3 grid, basic attack has it's own button, and so on).

Animations lock you into place, moving around in the battlefield is cumbersome? Fixing that is one way to vastly improve the system.

BR system, blahblah. Easy to figure out fixes for that one.

Auto-attack is like a half-assed fix to most of these problems. Further, with games like TERA coming out going back to old and overused auto-attack system is more of a downgrade than anything.

Granted, if they can somehow make it work more power to them. But the odds are not really on their side on this one. They should at the very least be informed about the alternatives.

[Cairdeas]

List of things I've seen Players fight for and against heavily.

Missing Genders
Mouse and Keyboard vs Gamepad
Jumping
Renaming Current Classes
Modern UI Elements that offer up information at a glance (Aggro/Level Icon)
etc.

[Frebaut]

This makes me laugh. So you want the game to stay the same? If that happens the game fails. Hell the game is failing a little each day. So they only way to save the game is by changing it.

Umm ya i don't take anything serious on these pointless threads. Doesn't matter what we say

[Moth]

Um.. they are changing it.

[Pablohoney]

Okay, are you 'spamming' the basic attack? How about designing encounters that require more than just spamming basic attack to defeat the monsters? I mean, if the content does not encourage the usage of other skills, people are not going to use them. Further, even with auto-attack, you would only use other skills because you are so bored out of your mind- the content is still as easy and boring as ever.

There is too much input lag- improve the server hardware and code?

Can't chat? Voice chat + something like FFXIII's queued attacks does the job.

Sucks to go back to action 1 when playing with a pad? Make the action bar more suited for gamepads (3x3 grid, basic attack has it's own button, and so on).

Animations lock you into place, moving around in the battlefield is cumbersome? Fixing that is one way to vastly improve the system.

BR system, blahblah. Easy to figure out fixes for that one.

Auto-attack is like a half-assed fix to most of these problems. Further, with games like TERA coming out going back to old and overused auto-attack system is more of a downgrade than anything.

Granted, if they can somehow make it work more power to them. But the odds are not really on their side on this one. They should at the very least be informed about the alternatives.

I agree with everything you've said. These are all changes that need to be implemented. Well, I don't really think voice chat is an acceptable solution to people who complain about not being able to communicate in combat, but I don't really consider that a very important problem with the battle system anyways.

As it stands, this game is like a menu based button masher. You're totally right, there is no strategy to any of the abilities, you just spam attacks until you have enough TP to use one that hits hard or debuffs and you rinse repeat. Clearly the combat needs to be rebalanced to encourage some strategy. I don't think adding autoattack is meant to address any of your concerns, I think it's just the first step in what will hopefully be a revamped battle system that is more engaging.

To me, if we could transpose FFXI's combat system over FFXIV the game would instantly become more fun. It wouldn't change any of the best parts of this game right now. I'm willing to give the dev team some latitude on this. I don't see them making the combat system any worse.

To tie this into my larger point though, and the purpose of this particular thread: something has got to give. We need to let them try to fix this game and fighting against a change to a system that is terrible right now just doesn't make sense to me.

[Betelgeuzah]

I'm willing to give the dev team some latitude on this. I don't see them making the combat system any worse.

My problem simply is that with the situation being as it is, "acceptable" is not "acceptable". I don't think they can... afford putting resources on developing features that are not going to benefit the game or making "mediocre" changes that could be so much better.

If auto-attack isn't meant to address any concerns, it really should be reconsidered as to whether it is a good use of resources with the game being the way it is. Or if people figure that when the game finally can stand on it's own feet, it's actually FFXI all over again with some other MMO flavor. Not good enough.

[Pablohoney]

My problem simply is that with the situation being as it is, "acceptable" is not "acceptable". I don't think they can... afford putting resources on developing features that are not going to benefit the game or making "mediocre" changes that could be so much better.

If auto-attack isn't meant to address any concerns, it really should be reconsidered as to whether it is a good use of resources with the game being the way it is. Or if people figure that when the game finally can stand on it's own feet, it's actually FFXI all over again with some other MMO flavor. Not good enough.

I get what you're saying, and I don't disagree. I personally would like to see the dev team ONLY focus on fixing core combat mechanics (enemy health, tp gain, redoing abilities and classes, targeting, etc.) and user interface problems. I think these concerns people have with adding missing genders and other "high level" concerns should be much lower priority. Make the combat/crafting/trading more fun, engaging and tactical and that will keep the people playing and having fun while you adjust the lore and other problems with the content.

Also to clarify, you have shown that you understand there are problems with this game that need to be addressed. You've offered examples of problems with the combat system that need to be fixed and all those changes could be made without implementing autoattack and things would improve. That's a well-reasoned and productive approach to the problem. If I understand correctly you're saying 'fix x,y,z and let's revisit if we still need autoattack at that point, because these are glaring issues with the combat system that should be easy fixes'. I think unfortunately there aren't many others who offer as much to these discussions on improving the game. They just say "autoattack is for noobs go play wow" and that's the end of it.

[Betelgeuzah]

Yeah I know, I just never got the impression that these people would be against -any- change. Just not the specific approach. You can never know for sure though.

I think that out of the 15-30k people playing, only a very tiny fraction thinks changes are bad at this point. Only the approach that SE "should take" differs from player to player. So in that sense, I don't think you have much to worry about. It's really hard for anyone to say with a straight face that this game does not need to be changed, lol.

[Kilta_Firelotus]

OP is mostly refering to those who want a carbon copy of ffxi. They want a "hard" game and to "skrew the casuals they are ruining our game" . This opinion is getting on my nerves now. ffxi obviousely didn't have a "large" player base @ ps2 launch garuda had about 3-4K ppl on around the clock. after a few years it droped to 2K around the clock, then 1K then server merged with lakshmi Last i checked players around the clock were @ 700 give or take. Not made up numbers i did /sea all alot when I was bored.
And i played all hours of the day. If we stick to how ffxi was ffxiv will end up the same, and isn't something I want. I want constent influx of players.

In order to do so weneed to the dev team to make changes that will bring in more players. That way parties are always quick to get. as there will be more ppl at all ranks.

[Kilta_Firelotus]

You are correct sir.

Of course the game needs changes. The problem isn't primarily whether or not there should be changes, it's the lack of consensus of what the changes should be. That and the fact that many changes are, as you mentioned, either instantly flamed as pushing the game towards being a WoW-clone or pushing it towards being FFXI 2.0.

I have faith they'll sort themselves out somehow it's really more a question of when than anything else.

Also, hmm.. which one... Go play Rift, because it has rifts.

so does several free MUD i know of