8.0 speculation

[Pimsan20]

So i'v been wondering on what 8.0 will become and I've seen posts that we might have a lot of ff based like 7, 6 and so on. But is it possible that 8.0 might be an original story with a couple of sprinkles of ref to FF games that might be related to the 8.0 story?

What do you guys think? Will 8.0 be an original story or a mix of several ff games ref?

[Cilia]

The current trend seems to be blending the protagonists and antagonists of previous titles and having them play antagonistic roles in the plotline, which is likely why people are reading the leaves and coming up with that. I would prefer an original plotline instead of a loose adaptation of a previous entry, but that does seem to be the direction things are headed if post-Endwalker's Void Arc and Dawntrail are accurate bellwethers.

Were I a betting man (and I assure you, I am not) my money would be on X.

[Cleretic]

Yeah, I think it will be original. Just like how I feel like every expansion before it was original.

Every FF expansion clearly takes some notes from a previous Final Fantasy in what sort of story it wants to tell and how to tell it, while then actually telling its own story in that same space; Heavensward is the hardest to read but it's sort of 'VII in different clothes', Stormblood is clearly riffing on VI and XII. Shadowbringers took notes from X and VII (Eulmore's a Midgar), while pretending it was taking notes from I. Endwalker is a little hard to read due to the famous expansion mashup, but I definitely read it as pulling from IV (even excluding the patch content), with some veins from VI, II, and possibly XV. And Dawntrail was obviously going for IX with a bit of X mostly as, like, connective tissue, but was doing IX in more complex ways than people give credit for; most people just saw the obvious markers like Alexandria and Sphene and kinda stopped there.

My gut feel for 8.0 (outside of 'I don't care yet, let me keep liking Dawntrail') is to either count VII out entirely, or to expect it to be sort of the 'fake inspiration', like 1 was to Shadowbringers; maybe the collectors' edition rewards are VII themed and we have something similar to how Stormblood's were V-themed despite the expansion very much not. I honestly think they've played the VII notes too often, and doing a 'VII Expansion' in the same way that Dawntrail is the 'IX Expansion' would mostly seem unoriginal; not only is VII a fairly 'active' corner of the property right now, but they've borrowed from VII so often before that it's just gonna feel like we've done all this before.

I think the next one going in on X would be a safe and strong bet, but I think VIII is an interesting vein they haven't done much with before, and I wouldn't be surprised to see that one take the lead. Or go absolutely wild and we hit, like, Type-0.

[Cilia]

I think the next one going in on X would be a safe and strong bet, but I think VIII is an interesting vein they haven't done much with before, and I wouldn't be surprised to see that one take the lead. Or go absolutely wild and we hit, like, Type-0.

VIII has it's iconic Triple Triad as an almost omnipresent part of the game, GNB which is pattered after Squall and Seifer's combat techniques, and Eden which is an abridged adaptation of VIII as a yuri romance instead of het. (You can't convince me otherwise.)

Outside of some cosmetics and the "obscure even to most X fans" Pelupelu randomly showing up in Dawntrail, what does X have? I'm drawing a bit of a blank...

I'd still prefer an original plot, I'm just saying.

[Cleretic]

VIII has it's iconic Triple Triad as an almost omnipresent part of the game, GNB which is pattered after Squall and Seifer's combat techniques, and Eden which is an abridged adaptation of VIII as a yuri romance instead of het. (You can't convince me otherwise.)

Outside of some cosmetics and the "obscure even to most X fans" Pelupelu randomly showing up in Dawntrail, what does X have? I'm drawing a bit of a blank...

I'd still prefer an original plot, I'm just saying.

I feel like X's had a lot of what I'd call 'undercurrent referencing'. It's rarely the main thing getting overtly referenced but it's clearly a prominent part of the pool. Like the Pelupelu, but also the Ronso being an inspiration for the Hrothgar (including being named that on the First), Bismarck basically being a Sin trial, Shadowbringers Amaurot DEFINITELY being based on Zanarkand, and I suspect the pilgrimage was an inspiration point for Dawntrail's rite of succession. It definitely has taken center-stage at some points, probably most prominently with Anima, but I feel like overall it's very rarely not in the mix. At the very least I feel like, if you did knuckle down and write out a 'FFX Expansion' you'd hit a lot more moments of 'huh, I guess they did use that before' than you'd expect.

I'd put VIII and X pretty much on par in terms of how many times XIV has 'done' them, with both of them being surprisingly rare for how prominent they are and both pretty well-positioned to be the next 'core' game for an expansion to riff on. It's just that VIII has gotten one or two more tentpole references you can very easily point to.

...come to think of it, patterning Halmarut on Edea/Ultimecia would be a pretty natural pick for an Ascian that's still fairly fresh.

[Cilia]

I feel like X's had a lot of what I'd call 'undercurrent referencing'. It's rarely the main thing getting overtly referenced but it's clearly a prominent part of the pool. Like the Pelupelu, but also the Ronso being an inspiration for the Hrothgar (including being named that on the First), Bismarck basically being a Sin trial, Shadowbringers Amaurot DEFINITELY being based on Zanarkand, and I suspect the pilgrimage was an inspiration point for Dawntrail's rite of succession. It definitely has taken center-stage at some points, probably most prominently with Anima, but I feel like overall it's very rarely not in the mix. At the very least I feel like, if you did knuckle down and write out a 'FFX Expansion' you'd hit a lot more moments of 'huh, I guess they did use that before' than you'd expect.

I'd put VIII and X pretty much on par in terms of how many times XIV has 'done' them, with both of them being surprisingly rare for how prominent they are and both pretty well-positioned to be the next 'core' game for an expansion to riff on. It's just that VIII has gotten one or two more tentpole references you can very easily point to.

...come to think of it, patterning Halmarut on Edea/Ultimecia would be a pretty natural pick for an Ascian that's still fairly fresh.

Valid points, though personally I wouldn't consider Bismark a riff on the Sin fight. I have a bad habit of forgetting about the Hrothgar ("Ronso") because like the Pelupelu they're pretty small in presence even in X other than Kimahri (who is... not the most popular character), and Anima... wound up being shockingly minimal in presence for the hyped-up fight against an iconic summon. It's easy to forget; and yeah, I know it's because they mashed the "Garlemald War 2: Electric Boogaloo" expansion into Endwalker.

I don't know if I would consider the first act of Dawntrail as being a take on the Summoner's Pilgrimage; the characters are still a bit too patterned after IX characters and the goal is nothing alike. I feel it's got shades of IX's Mist / Outer Continent sections, but it's just a little too truncated to fully commit.

With my memory jogging, I figure... maybe we already "did" "The X Expansion" back in Heavensward, or at least poked at it's narrative premise (albeit with a lot less angst and fake laughing).

I doubt we'd get another take on Ultimecia, though. Her character is already decomposited into Gaia (time magic, E12S boss) and Mitron (real name Artemis, referencing Ultimecia's JP name "Artemisia;" shares her goal of time compression, summons Griever / Fatebreaker, forcibly junctions (fuses) a protagonist to herself, etc.) so I'm skeptical they'd do that; and in my opinion Edea doesn't have enough character on her own to carry that kind of role.

We can kick around ideas all day, but at this point I think there's still just not enough information to make even an educated guess. At 7.45 we should start getting some information soon, though we didn't get the impetus to venture to Tural until 7.55 so who knows.

[Cilia]

Hate to double post, but this is important stuff.

Live Letter XCI dropped the first hints at 7.5 and beyond.

Patch 7.5 will be titled Trail to the Heavens. The first part (7.5) is scheduled to release April 28, while the second part is slated for early September. There are two pieces of patch key art: one showing Endless Sphene (eyes closed) holding real Sphene's hand, with Calyx to the left of Endless Sphene and the WoL to the right of real Sphene; and another showing Krile, Y'shtola, Alphinaud, the WoL, Estinien, Alisae, and G'raha arranged clockwise with the moon in the background. Released screenshots so far include Shale looking back over her shoulder at a screen, Urianger kneeling down and talking to a loporrit, the WoL speaking to Calyx in his new Mica plush vessel, and the WoL looking up at the moon.

The new dungeon is "The Clyteum," which appears to be a bombed-out district of the Garlean capital. I guess we were never gonna be without Alphinaud and Alisae's company for very long, huh.

The new trial is Enuo, a background character (superboss in updated rereleases) from V who learned to wield the Void. This is a very interesting choice, since we don't have any context regarding his appearance. Is he just a side trial unrelated to the MSQ that's accessible through the Occult Crescent story (as Varis EX was part of Bozja)? If not, why is a big V homage showing up, and what role could he have to play (other than, after being beat into submission, serving as a conduit to other reflections)? I suppose he's a natural fit for a story that increasingly looks to be about hopping across alternate realities, but it still feels odd in light of Occult Crescent already being a V homage vehicle in the same expack. Oddly, he has some kind of sigil hovering behind him his V incarnation lacks... I tried to compare it to the esper glyphs from XII since Ascian glyphs are parts of those flipped upside down, but I can't figure out which it is if any. Maybe Chaos or Zeromus.

There's a lot more coming up (Windurst: The Third Walk capping off Echos of Vana'diel, Occult Crescent: North Horn and Forked Tower: Magic concluding the Occult Crescent and Phantom Weapons, an Allied Society capstone quest, the conclusion of Dawntrail's Hildibrand questline, the final Cosmic Exploration planet Auxesia, which appears to be an urban area that's been heavily reclaimed by nature, Beastmaster finally being added, and other bells and whistles like a new PvP arena and housing updates), but those are the big "What's happening in 8.0?" tidbits so far which is to say... without context, a whole lotta nothing.

[Cleretic]

The new dungeon is "The Clyteum," which appears to be a bombed-out district of the Garlean capital. I guess we were never gonna be without Alphinaud and Alisae's company for very long, huh.

The interesting thing to note here is that, despite looking very Garlean in structure, style and climate, and Yoshi-P specifically pointing out that it's Garlean, there's not a single reused Garlean asset. Even the street lamps are a different design. Which is a weird amount of effort to go to; if it's part of Garlemald, either the city or the nation, why not reuse a building or two? Why rebuild everything from scratch? I don't have an answer for that, but I do think the elephant in the room for answering that is 'maybe it isn't Garlemald'.


And personally, I had Enuo pegged for the Occult Crescent ever since we learned about the Forked Tower; he's damn near the only FFV thing they haven't touched yet. I suspect this is just a trial outside the main story path, and is just part of the Occult Crescent; something similar to Asura in Endwalker, or even Delubrum Reginae.

And no, the symbol behind his head isn't an Ascian thing, honestly doesn't look that much like one anyway, and I'm really hopeful that theory goes nowhere fast. If this fanbase has a worst habit when speculating, it's finding the first answer that lets them say 'Ascians' and then never accepting any other theory until that one is COMPLETELY dead; we saw it with the Arcadion's symbol, we saw it with Endless Sphene's crest, and I really hope we don't see it a third time soon.

[Cassar]

Highly doubt this trial is anything other than an MSQ trial. We of course don't know the context of it but I can't imagine them making people do Occult Crescent just to be able to do the trial.
Also, by the way, does anyone else find it extremely weird (and ugly) that the trial name is the same as the boss name? We always have cool titles like "The Ageless Necropolis", "Hell on Rails", but this one is just... "Enuo"? I want to believe this was somehow a mistake in the live letter, or maybe they don't wanna reveal the real title for spoiler reasons

As for the MSQ implications... This is very interesting. So the things we know for sure is:

-We'll get advancements (probably a breakthrough) in studying the key (Shale screenshot).
-We'll meet Calyx and then we'll look at the moon (both screenshots are confirmed to be in Mor Dhona).
-We'll meet Urianger on the moon. To reach the moon we'll probably use the tower in Garlemald, so the dungeon might have something to do with that, I don't know.
-Our trial will be against someone who'll presumably be a void overlord. Meaning we'll most likely go to the void somehow.
-Estinien is at the forefront of the patch art, and I have no clue what his involvement in the story will be.
-Urianger and Thancred are not in the patch art, although we do know at least Urianger will be a part of this MSQ.

I definitely subscribe to the idea that we'll be beginning the process of opening the way to other reflections. Looks like 8.0 might not be in the source after all, although I wonder if they'll do the entire expansion in the same reflection, or if half the zones will be in one, and half in another. Of course, this is all speculation.

What do you think?

[Zero-ELEC]

Highly doubt this trial is anything other than an MSQ trial. We of course don't know the context of it but I can't imagine them making people do Occult Crescent just to be able to do the trial.
Also, by the way, does anyone else find it extremely weird (and ugly) that the trial name is the same as the boss name? We always have cool titles like "The Ageless Necropolis", "Hell on Rails", but this one is just... "Enuo"? I want to believe this was somehow a mistake in the live letter, or maybe they don't wanna reveal the real title for spoiler reasons

They don't always show the name of the trial the first time they mention it in a Letter from the Producer LIVE, especially since the Japanese titles of trials are just "[name of boss] showdown".