A MSQ where we lose to the bad guys

[Starrya]

This is a tough one, because while I do agree that a shake up of the formula would do wonders, it's also so difficult to do that in a way that doesn't just outright fail. If somebody gets one over on us, AND the stakes are high, AND we have to fester in that feeling for 6 months to see the resolution, I don't think any writing exists that could make up for that. Ironically, the better it is written, the worse it will make people feel. If it is done poorly, people will complain about that, and if it is done well, people will not be able to dissociate from the powerful feelings to appreciate how well it was done.

[Shinku_Tachi]

This is a tough one, because while I do agree that a shake up of the formula would do wonders, it's also so difficult to do that in a way that doesn't just outright fail. If somebody gets one over on us, AND the stakes are high, AND we have to fester in that feeling for 6 months to see the resolution, I don't think any writing exists that could make up for that. Ironically, the better it is written, the worse it will make people feel. If it is done poorly, people will complain about that, and if it is done well, people will not be able to dissociate from the powerful feelings to appreciate how well it was done.

True, but with an audience as big as 14 has now, there is really no avoiding upsetting a subset of players. You could have, effectively, an 11/10 story, with 11/10 characters and character development, and an 11/10 ending (happy or sad / unsettling), and there would be a group of players taking to the official forums, r/FFXIV, Twitter, Bluesky, or wherever else to woof and moan about it.

So if it all ends in the same outcome, I'd rather have something that takes chances and is a bit daring, than another episode of Shonen Jump Redux.

[Starrya]

True, but with an audience as big as 14 has now, there is really no avoiding upsetting a subset of players. You could have, effectively, an 11/10 story, with 11/10 characters and character development, and an 11/10 ending (happy or sad / unsettling), and there would be a group of players taking to the official forums, r/FFXIV, Twitter, Bluesky, or wherever else to woof and moan about it.

So if it all ends in the same outcome, I'd rather have something that takes chances and is a bit daring, than another episode of Shonen Jump Redux.

Yeah, there is a subset of doomers that literally just doom on the game because it gets them clicks and views. The point I was making is that leaving the story on a truly sour note where we really lost something important, then having to sit on that for months has the potential to rub a much larger population the wrong way.

It's also true that the story feels like it has played it quite safe for a few expansions, and that is getting pretty plain. That is particularly noticeable now that we are starting a new story, so the stakes are inherently lower than they have been. I too hope that they take some risks and that those risks pay off.

[Selsix]

I want a MSQ where we ARE the bad guys, but for the greater good. This is what I expected from Shadowbringers but while Shadowbringers was still a masterpiece, it didn't scratch this itch I never even knew I had.

[Batbrat]

I thought that's what Dawntrail was.

[Absurdity]

I despise this community sometimes, they can't stand it when their WoL isn't in the spotlight and a godlike hero who always win. People complained when we lost to zenos, complained that lyse stole our spotlight, complained when the story make us run away from ranjit, and don't get me started with In From the Cold.

We have a staggering amount of people with main character syndrome...which is unfortunately not surprising when the game has encouraged it for years.

Granted part of the complaints might be simply down to execution. I found "In Crimson It Began" disappointing not because we lost but because it felt very artificial and forced, "In From The Cold" did a much better job at making us feel weak.
Zenos just becomes invulnerable at some point and slowly casts a oneshot. What I would've preferred is that the mechanics ramp up in frequency and complexity to a point that you simply can't dodge him anymore, actually showing that he beat you because he is faster and stronger than you.

[MsQi]

How about an MSQ where you could choose the be the "Bad Guy"? Or at least go against what some of your "friends" want

I remember how based Alisaie was when she said how messed up the Alexandrian soul system was. Then stupid Krile is all "It's their culture, blah blah blah". I wanted to drop kick Krile right then and there. Then me and Alisaie could completely destroy the system, not just turn off the fake afterlife, and release ALL the souls to pass on as they should. Then I would form my own scions with hookers and blackjack.... I mean the characters I like.

[CNitsah]

We have a staggering amount of people with main character syndrome...which is unfortunately not surprising when the game has encouraged it for years.

Granted part of the complaints might be simply down to execution. I found "In Crimson It Began" disappointing not because we lost but because it felt very artificial and forced, "In From The Cold" did a much better job at making us feel weak.
Zenos just becomes invulnerable at some point and slowly casts a oneshot. What I would've preferred is that the mechanics ramp up in frequency and complexity to a point that you simply can't dodge him anymore, actually showing that he beat you because he is faster and stronger than you.

This.
Do that and tease him during HW as an exceptionnal and very dangerous general, and the whole thing would have been far better.

[Shistar]

This.
Do that and tease him during HW as an exceptionnal and very dangerous general, and the whole thing would have been far better.

While I agree with the first bit, I think him just dropping in, beating us up and leaving was also good for the shock factor. You'd think he's just another Garlean waiting to get his express pass to the Lifestream and then realize how wrong you were and how screwed we are if you can't figure out a way to defeat him very soon. It builds this sense of dread that you wouldn't quite have if they kept spelling out he was going to be the next Big Bad for ages before he shows up.


I just really dislike the forced Down for the Count debuff moments, especially if you were full HP prior to it. So cheap... lol

[MsQi]

I despise this community sometimes, they can't stand it when their WoL isn't in the spotlight and a godlike hero who always win. People complained when we lost to zenos, complained that lyse stole our spotlight, complained when the story make us run away from ranjit, and don't get me started with In From the Cold.

Like one person. It's fine to lose, but it should be because of bad decisions.

Lyse was a solution to a false mystery. Turns out Ida is actually Lyse! Who the F is Lyse! She's the missing "princess" that nobody knew was missing till suddenly they did. Then everyone is like "I knew all along but didn't want to say" Nobody cared that somebody took the spotlight, just that her existence is a lousy plot device.