Opinion piece about the 7.3 changes, with a community focus on the Purify change

[merlin_xiv]

Hola Tal'ke! Thank you for the video and the efforts to have discussion for PvP.

I haven't been able to reach a decision as to wither I prefer the change or not just yet and it's for more than one reason. So I'll try to share where my mind is at at this current time.
1. I'm okay with them taking risks, it's healthy to test new things as it can give the development more information to potentially reach greater things in general.
1.5. With that said the problem with this is the patch cycles are too slow for them to quickly take steps back if needed.
2. To mitigate game changing mechanics I feel that a pre-season in Ranked play should coincide with such a change. That way we can digest being their testers, without the feelsbad. Something no longer than a month preferably though again we go back to the issue above in 1.5.
3. I believe the purify change was made away from the rest of the changes we received this patch. If you look at them side by side it looks like there is no parallels to one another which to me makes the purify change fall short of it's main design. I.E See Miracle of Nature / Encore of Light MP drains.

I'm not against this iteration of purify yet and am trying to stay open minded. As an experienced player I can only agree that it is definitely a punishing change for newer players (especially in Crystalline Conflict). I hope we can keep a healthy discussion going from here on and that Square can consider some of our feedback.

[Themarvin]

We don't all play the same job, so it less or more of a thing for opponents.
For frontline at least, melee classes are more exposed to cc, than ranged, yet ranged have the same (and even more) access to cc and some have access to MP removal. And also melee are more punished by cc effect due to their need to stay closer to enemies.
Balance is completely bonkered with the current change.

You are getting as many purify removals as your MP allow...

You also need to account for ability to survirve.. alot of melee DPS is literally tanks, meaning if you want to remove more CC removals ( which will hit any job no matter if ranged, close range or whatever, then it even out the vulnerability quite a bit between the jobs, meaning if you need to use MP for it you really need to plan well and not just able to jump into things as you where before and that is when we speak frontline, where purify is more or less useless anyway as you would be jumped by 10 players regardless or whatever or job.

As for when playing CC... well then it is another deal on top of being able to pick heal to full potions in combat, you get to purify more at a cost, not negating the ability to heal yourself or to pick up a potion and it adds to the spice... you get a choice to spam your self heal or to remove an effect on you up to 4 times in a row as it is now, if they made it cost nothing it would make no sense to have at all, and purify no matter job/class/style should be used ONLY in absolutely points of no return.

Quite a few melee jobs just seem to power through, that the playing field is evened more out for all jobs I only see as a bonus, and if you are the type of person that can only play the OP meta, and for that sake anyone else, well... then it is time to git gud.

[Divinemights]

Well, this feels like another Patch 3.2 melee apocalypse all over again.
Every Frontline match you enter now has maybe one or two tanks, and if you’re lucky, a single melee.
At this point, I think a blanket 50% damage reduction for all melee in Frontline is pretty much unavoidable.

[Valence]

Yes that's something I actually forgot but the amount of one sided, totally lopsided games is absolutely crazy right now, and that's at ALL ranks. Games that end within 2-3 minutes if not less are very common, and extremely frustrating or unsatisfying even on the side of the winners.

This is going to be a singular example from my personal experience of course so ultimately I have no statistic to make blanket statements about this, but I've been playing WAR quite a bit in ranked, and I find it a little depressing and ironic that a job that I don't even main makes me go through any game that's lower than crystal rated because just landing your tools properly just murders everyone with crowd control and the LB equally so. Meanwhile, I have no clue how to play that job at the highest levels properly and yet I've had more success with it than with my main jobs even in crystal/omega lobbies.

I'd be very curious to see the win rates for each job this season. This is going to be entertaining.

As for when playing CC... well then it is another deal on top of being able to pick heal to full potions in combat, you get to purify more at a cost, not negating the ability to heal yourself or to pick up a potion and it adds to the spice... you get a choice to spam your self heal or to remove an effect on you up to 4 times in a row as it is now, if they made it cost nothing it would make no sense to have at all, and purify no matter job/class/style should be used ONLY in absolutely points of no return.

lol who even needs to purify 4 times in a row in CC?

[Themarvin]

Yes that's something I actually forgot but the amount of one sided, totally lopsided games is absolutely crazy right now, and that's at ALL ranks. Games that end within 2-3 minutes if not less are very common, and extremely frustrating or unsatisfying even on the side of the winners.

This is going to be a singular example from my personal experience of course so ultimately I have no statistic to make blanket statements about this, but I've been playing WAR quite a bit in ranked, and I find it a little depressing and ironic that a job that I don't even main makes me go through any game that's lower than crystal rated because just landing your tools properly just murders everyone with crowd control and the LB equally so. Meanwhile, I have no clue how to play that job at the highest levels properly and yet I've had more success with it than with my main jobs even in crystal/omega lobbies.

I'd be very curious to see the win rates for each job this season. This is going to be entertaining.



lol who even needs to purify 4 times in a row in CC?

I don't know, it baffles me, it is like people do not understand that they get more ways to get out of trouble and then complain about it, the only thing with the new system is that it balances it more between close range and ranged, where close range had the slight advantage before the changes if anything.

[Valence]

In CC you ever need one purify at most to get out of a burst, and that it now costs you 15k HP when it costed nothing before (and lasted longer). You could make one argument for going back into the fray and having purify back again (which wasn't the case before, you had to wait for 24s), but I'd argue that doing so without guard is equally foolish.

[TofuLove]

You are getting as many purify removals as your MP allow...

You also need to account for ability to survirve.. alot of melee DPS is literally tanks, meaning if you want to remove more CC removals ( which will hit any job no matter if ranged, close range or whatever, then it even out the vulnerability quite a bit between the jobs, meaning if you need to use MP for it you really need to plan well and not just able to jump into things as you where before and that is when we speak frontline, where purify is more or less useless anyway as you would be jumped by 10 players regardless or whatever or job.

As for when playing CC... well then it is another deal on top of being able to pick heal to full potions in combat, you get to purify more at a cost, not negating the ability to heal yourself or to pick up a potion and it adds to the spice... you get a choice to spam your self heal or to remove an effect on you up to 4 times in a row as it is now, if they made it cost nothing it would make no sense to have at all, and purify no matter job/class/style should be used ONLY in absolutely points of no return.

Quite a few melee jobs just seem to power through, that the playing field is evened more out for all jobs I only see as a bonus, and if you are the type of person that can only play the OP meta, and for that sake anyone else, well... then it is time to git gud.

I don't touch CC - not interested in it at all, so I have no opinion about purify change in CC.

In frontline you get 24 people on the opposite team that can cc you if you go in. When you have a few of them white mages and bards, your MP basically doesn't exist. So there is no purify to use.
MP removal has been the case for awhile, but purify change made it just more annoying.
Additionally 2s is basically a gcd, and when I play on JP or NA - it's quite painful. In the past you'd be surprised how good I managed to survive even vs 10 rouletters. Obviously if it's in qsync - there is no chance to be so out of position.

Refer to divinemights summary of what's wrong with it - I agree with everything they said. If you play a melee these days in frontline you basically choosing to play on hard mode for no reason, which is sad.

Regarding git good - I have over 1k wins in frontline cumulatively, and been playing it for years on different accounts and data centres. I think I am alright as a player, but obviously can always get better. And some classes I am just downright terrible at because I don't enjoy their playstyle.
I really only play for fun - and if I am not having fun, I am good to not play the game. Which is sad, but it is what it is.

[Themarvin]

I don't touch CC - not interested in it at all, so I have no opinion about purify change in CC.

In frontline you get 24 people on the opposite team that can cc you if you go in. When you have a few of them white mages and bards, your MP basically doesn't exist. So there is no purify to use.
MP removal has been the case for awhile, but purify change made it just more annoying.
Additionally 2s is basically a gcd, and when I play on JP or NA - it's quite painful. In the past you'd be surprised how good I managed to survive even vs 10 rouletters. Obviously if it's in qsync - there is no chance to be so out of position.

Refer to divinemights summary of what's wrong with it - I agree with everything they said. If you play a melee these days in frontline you basically choosing to play on hard mode for no reason, which is sad.

Regarding git good - I have over 1k wins in frontline cumulatively, and been playing it for years on different accounts and data centres. I think I am alright as a player, but obviously can always get better. And some classes I am just downright terrible at because I don't enjoy their playstyle.
I really only play for fun - and if I am not having fun, I am good to not play the game. Which is sad, but it is what it is.

If you get jumped in Frontline, your chances of survival is slim no matter what, unless you know your placement and am able to put walls between you and the enemy, that is the same scenario for anyone, everyone got the same advantage or disadvantage.

Deal with it.

[TofuLove]

If you get jumped in Frontline, your chances of survival is slim no matter what, unless you know your placement and am able to put walls between you and the enemy, that is the same scenario for anyone, everyone got the same advantage or disadvantage.

Deal with it.

Refer to my previous comments about advantages/disadvantages of melee & ranged. To me it's very obvious you can play this mode as a melee, which is defensively (unless you are maybe viper,gunbreaker or maybe paladin). I am usually the shot caller and jumper so i know a fair bit about setting up plays. Prevalence of ranged meta is very obvious to me right now.

"Deal with it"
I find it hard to take you seriously now...

Maybe I will even seen you on Light, if you play on that DC that is...

[Miki_L]

Melees should be able to kill other Melees. Add a flat damage reduction to all ranged jobs instead. Also, get rid of Eagle Eye shot. Just not an interesting role action.