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  1. #1
    Player
    Valence's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    5,332
    Character
    Sunie Dakwhil
    World
    Twintania
    Main Class
    Machinist Lv 100
    The content also requires less team interaction. Back then you could ask whether or not you wanted to clear side rooms or get more mobs for optional xp or rewards. You could talk and give advice on how to better tank or position mobs or bosses, or just about how to deal with specific things in general.
    All of this has been essentially been axed out of the game, and since everything has turned into individual binary checks everywhere, then there is no reason to interact anymore.
    Add this to the fact that when people reached a new low in EW with how "boring" dungeons turned out to be, it made people want to get out of there even faster and didn't exactly push them to actually talk. Or how the content has been macdonaldized: people queue up after work like they'd order a fast food, and they don't even do it for the quality of the food either.
    (8)

  2. #2
    Player
    Atma's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    164
    Character
    Shiari Eventide
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    Samurai Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Valence View Post
    The content also requires less team interaction. Back then you could ask whether or not you wanted to clear side rooms or get more mobs for optional xp or rewards.
    And the answer, as it has been since time immemorial, was 'no', because it was never worth it. And I vehemently hate, and have always hated, 'skippable' content in dungeons, especially when it utilized what was functionally exploits to skip it. Wildstar was huge on that, it was just awful.

    You could talk and give advice on how to better tank or position mobs or bosses, or just about how to deal with specific things in general.
    The notion that you 'can't talk or give advice' etc is a myth pushed by people who got banned for toxic 'advice' delivered in the same scathing manner as it was in other MMOs. No one is getting banned for saying 'can you please tank it to the north' or 'can you please slow down I'm struggling.' or anything like that. The reality is that people don't really need to give or receive this 'advice' because collectively the gaming community has been playing MMOs for decades now. Things like "face the boss away from the party", "don't stand near the head of a butt or head of a dragon unless you need to", "Don't stand in crap on the floor" are so baked in that it's simply unnecessary to communicate these concepts unless it is something designed to specifically 'flip the script' (e.g Necropurge in Weeping City). We 'communicate less' because we don't need to communicate. If people die to something, it's usually incredibly obvious why and in the rare cases it is not, they'll eventually ask.

    The notion that people 'need advice' is in and of itself kind of tiresome. Some people want to figure things out on their own or learn by trial and error. If it isn't your savage group then who cares - let them. The thrill of discovery used to be a thing in gaming, and started being smothered back as long ago as when Gamefaqs hit the scene. Just let people have fun.
    (6)

  3. #3
    Player
    Valence's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    5,332
    Character
    Sunie Dakwhil
    World
    Twintania
    Main Class
    Machinist Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Atma View Post
    And the answer, as it has been since time immemorial, was 'no', because it was never worth it. And I vehemently hate, and have always hated, 'skippable' content in dungeons, especially when it utilized what was functionally exploits to skip it. Wildstar was huge on that, it was just awful.
    I'm not exactly going to argue for optional parts of dungeons to be back, the only point I made was that it generated interactions in parties, and that I have never seen said interactions turn sour or toxic and most people have always been happy to accommodate. I don't think that type of content had ever been an actual detriment to the game in spite of what SE may seem to think. It was such a non issue that when they finally said they "fixed" this, I was a little confused to say the least.


    Quote Originally Posted by Atma View Post
    The notion that you 'can't talk or give advice' etc is a myth pushed by people who got banned for toxic 'advice' delivered in the same scathing manner as it was in other MMOs. No one is getting banned for saying 'can you please tank it to the north' or 'can you please slow down I'm struggling.' or anything like that. The reality is that people don't really need to give or receive this 'advice' because collectively the gaming community has been playing MMOs for decades now. Things like "face the boss away from the party", "don't stand near the head of a butt or head of a dragon unless you need to", "Don't stand in crap on the floor" are so baked in that it's simply unnecessary to communicate these concepts unless it is something designed to specifically 'flip the script' (e.g Necropurge in Weeping City). We 'communicate less' because we don't need to communicate. If people die to something, it's usually incredibly obvious why and in the rare cases it is not, they'll eventually ask.

    The notion that people 'need advice' is in and of itself kind of tiresome. Some people want to figure things out on their own or learn by trial and error. If it isn't your savage group then who cares - let them. The thrill of discovery used to be a thing in gaming, and started being smothered back as long ago as when Gamefaqs hit the scene. Just let people have fun.
    I never referred to any toxic advice or anything. You're going on a rant on something totally unrelated.

    I quite bluntly implied: today, there is nothing left to give advice on when running any piece of content but extremes/savages/ultimates and even for those, you'll quickly get a raidplan to follow to the letter anyway. No need to talk ingame about it much either.
    (2)
    Secretly had a crush on Mao