Here we go again

[Mawlzy]

And yet, OSRS and WoW are significantly harder gamers and have far more active players.

I'd suggest difficulty is somewhat subjective. And WoW has difficulty levels one can choose.

More to the point, perhaps, FFXIV is failing on multiple fronts, thereby driving down player numbers. When there are simple solutions to retain less-skilled players, it seems odd not to implement them.

[Altina_Orion]

I'd suggest difficulty is somewhat subjective. And WoW has difficulty levels one can choose.

More to the point, perhaps, FFXIV is failing on multiple fronts, thereby driving down player numbers. When there are simple solutions to retain less-skilled players, it seems odd not to implement them.

True, but normal mode on ffxiv is equivilant to normal on wow. I would argue that Normal on WoW is often times harder than normal on ffxiv. Wow has Heroic and Mythic+ as well. It really only goes up from here.

[Mawlzy]

True, but normal mode on ffxiv is equivilant to normal on wow. I would argue that Normal on WoW is often times harder than normal on ffxiv. Wow has Heroic and Mythic+ as well. It really only goes up from here.

Probably depends on whether one is more comfortable with predictive vs reactive combat.

And I still don't understand why driving players from FFXIV is a good thing.

[Altina_Orion]

Probably depends on whether one is more comfortable with predictive vs reactive combat.

And I still don't understand why driving players from FFXIV is a good thing.

Because there are other issues driving players away as well, and a lot of it is a lack of engaging replayable content at endgame. People aren't quitting in droves during dry patches because they are too challenged. I would argue that the lack of difficulty drives more people away than the presence of it, even if that isnt your personal experience.

[Mawlzy]

Because there are other issues driving players away as well, and a lot of it is a lack of engaging replayable content at endgame. People aren't quitting in droves during dry patches because they are too challenged. I would argue that the lack of difficulty drives more people away than the presence of it, even if that isnt your personal experience.

Right. We have diametrically opposed personal experience of this issue that doubtless colors our conclusions. For example, your FC probably still exists.

If SE would simply ask me and others why we're quitting, we'd be happy to tell them.

[Metaknigh]

Right. We have diametrically opposed personal experience of this issue that doubtless colors our conclusions. For example, your FC probably still exists.

If SE would simply ask me and others why we're quitting, we'd be happy to tell them.

Genuinely, your FC does not make the majority of players, if they could not get through content in Dawntrail it's incredibly questionable how they did anything like Stormblood or Shadowbringers content as those were harder expansions. People quitting is not due to difficult content, it's other things entirely like job homogenization, I'm sorry but this isn't a difficult dungeon by most standards. If it uniquely challenges you then the best you can do is not do so in trusts and use other players to help as trusts are more difficult in general due to them being slower damage dealers and less reactive healing.

Also wrt to why no battle rez from Trusts, the simple answer is there's no failure state then if you can be picked up by trusts it becomes trivial to bot dungeons as all they need is to move forward and not care about doing mechanics. There's also simply no incentive for players to become better if they need to take the smallest amount of personal responsibility to stay alive. SE does want players to learn and understand mechanics, not simply face tank everything as that is frankly, boring.

[Mawlzy]

Genuinely, your FC does not make the majority of players, if they could not get through content in Dawntrail it's incredibly questionable how they did anything like Stormblood or Shadowbringers content as those were harder expansions. People quitting is not due to difficult content, it's other things entirely like job homogenization, I'm sorry but this isn't a difficult dungeon by most standards. If it uniquely challenges you then the best you can do is not do so in trusts and use other players to help as trusts are more difficult in general due to them being slower damage dealers and less reactive healing.

Also wrt to why no battle rez from Trusts, the simple answer is there's no failure state then if you can be picked up by trusts it becomes trivial to bot dungeons as all they need is to move forward and not care about doing mechanics. There's also simply no incentive for players to become better if they need to take the smallest amount of personal responsibility to stay alive. SE does want players to learn and understand mechanics, not simply face tank everything as that is frankly, boring.

What is this obsession with players getting better? Why is it so hard to understand that some are maxed out? I understand my FC doesn't make up the bulk of the player base, but when all your friends quit because the dungeon difficulty has reached the point they dread reaching the next one in the MSQ, it presents something of a problem.

I actually still want a harder difficulty. The dungeon is still quite easy after a run or two. It would be nice if they applied the new "Quantum" mechanics to dungeons to make them far more challenging.

Give us a easy, normal and hard mode and your wish will be fulfilled!