Dear SE: Please listen to actual players, not just content creators

[ElysiumDragon]

'Midcore' players don't exist tbh. They're either casual players with an unhealthy ego because "At least we're not like those Limsa catgirls", or hardcore players in denial.

[Rawazh]

Can you please stop pretending that only YouTubers and Streamers do Savage and Ultimate content because that simply isn't the case. Certain glams and lore should be locked behind high end content because its an incentive for those who make the time to learn the mechanics and enrage with the content. And yes I mean make time because yes you may be too old and short on time but most raiders work full-time jobs and set their short free time aside to learn these fights because they enjoy them, if you can't or won't put the time aside you shouldn't get the same rewards as those who do, otherwise why would they engage in the content?

Also yes high end raiders care about the game. We aren't the devil but we also don't see why casual players should get the same mount as us for no work.

I'm glad you are able to read a sentence, i'm sorry for you not being capable of reading the entire room.

Engaging in savage content doesn't make you above the rest of the player base, the time you put in there is equal the time casual gamers put somewhere else in that same game, what are you on about?
Just because you get a good grade at school, doesn't allow you to be condescendent towards your other classmates you know?

We're both paying the same amount of money at the end of the month to play the same game, so no, you're not above the rest of the playerbase just because the time you allow is different than mine in there.
Just because you're younger or have much capabilities, doesn't allow you to gatekeep all the rewards.
I'm playing everyday with my friends, and one of them is 60y/o, she loves the game as much as everyone, she spends time lvling and crafting, she engages in content as much as she can, but you'll never see her in savage nor ultimate, nor even in forked tower , but she was in castrum, in DR, in Dalriada - So why is she being punished for her age, while she pays as much as you ?
Who are you?

Even world of warcraft allow casual players to get the same rewards by different ways, they understood that their player base is getting old, is having a full time job, a family and they don't have the time to allow huge amount of hours to their game, and they still think about them, they still provide ways for the casuals to still keep up with the hardcore ones.
You're the part of the community no ones like, you're the kind of person who thinks that, since they get the better grade for "working more", others are not worthy.

[SaltyDaddy]

'Midcore' players don't exist tbh. They're either casual players with an unhealthy ego because "At least we're not like those Limsa catgirls", or hardcore players in denial.

The only difference between a "casual" and "midcore" player is, that the "casual" player is still too scared to try things in my opinion.
But everyone slices these categories differently.

[Aniise]

Final Fantasy 14 Content Creators are as disconnected to the actual players as Instagram Influencers are to real life.

All they want is for the devs to make content that boosts their own content and, as such, their income. That's all they really care about, as it is basically their job.

So only listening to their wants and needs will for the most part not improve the game for its core player base.
And I fear, it shows in the game already. :/

[SaltyDaddy]

I'm glad you are able to read a sentence, i'm sorry for you not being capable of reading the entire room.

I also played Delubrum Savage with a 63yo great-grandfather and his son.

But I don't understand your point. Different content have different rewards. Are you right now arguing, that rewards for savage/ultimate should be accessible for everyone by different means? Just because someone engages in different content for the same ammount of time? It is basically saying "I want a salary of our CEO as a blue-collar". It doesn't work like that in real world. Same isn't working in games. Every type of content have different rewards for it.

Or, on the other hand... As a savage raider, I want to have the black robot mount for 500k points in the crafting, without doing any crafting! It is unfair that people, who have time to log in only to do the savage clears and then continue with their lives don't have time to do long crafting grind!

We all are getting older. We all have real life and not much time to play anymore. But are we really arguing about rewards? Then wait two years and unsync it with a group. Or, if you want to work for it, even in current expansions. There are still people progging M4S and there are still gonna be groups doing it in the next savage tier. It is gonna be much simpler, yet still fun and you will practice your memory of patterns.

Right now, you are making a devil of a normal player again. I don't get it. I don't think with these statements, you are making yourself "liked by the community".

Even world of warcraft allow casual players to get the same rewards by different ways, they understood that their player base is getting old, is having a full time job, a family and they don't have the time to allow huge amount of hours to their game, and they still think about them, they still provide ways for the casuals to still keep up with the hardcore ones.
You're the part of the community no ones like, you're the kind of person who thinks that, since they get the better grade for "working more", others are not worthy.

You sure? I didn't knew that players not engaging with high level M+ keys can get their mount outside of M+.

[kumikosi]

Even world of warcraft allow casual players to get the same rewards by different ways, they understood that their player base is getting old, is having a full time job, a family and they don't have the time to allow huge amount of hours to their game, and they still think about them, they still provide ways for the casuals to still keep up with the hardcore ones.
You're the part of the community no ones like, you're the kind of person who thinks that, since they get the better grade for "working more", others are not worthy.

Right. Sure WoW certainly does that. They don't lock rewards behind achievements that can only be done by completing heroic tier of raiding before the next raid comes out that can never be achieved again. So is thus locked forever to anyone who didn't play at the time or at the skill level to complete that content. I should be able to get my Fractal Cypher of the Carcinized Zerethsteed any day now then.

WoW is not more friendly in that regard. They much like FFXIV lock mounts, flight forms, heck even a hunter pet skin/type behind Mythic raiding. Which much like XIV can't be 'casually' done for an expansion or so. (Trying to use the forum's definition of casual we may be talking many many expansions.)

[Khryseis_Astra]

The only difference between a "casual" and "midcore" player is, that the "casual" player is still too scared to try things in my opinion.
But everyone slices these categories differently.

I’d agree to an extent, there’s a lot of people afraid to try harder content, especially if they don’t feel like the environment is supportive. But I think it depends on whether someone is defining these terms by one’s estimation of their skill level or one’s gaming focus.

I’d consider myself midcore because to me that means “middle of the road.” I do Extremes, I cleared & farmed Chaotic, and I might try Savage but usually I’m not clearing til the next expansion so I can do it unsynced. I’m not particularly “good,” but I try my best.

But my focus in the game? That’s casual. The story is most important to me, interacting with and enjoying the world and its characters, glam, housing, exploratory content like field ops or variant dungeons, society quests, crafting and gathering, PvP. If I’m farming, it’s for glam or a housing item. I don’t care about BiS because I’m not doing current Savage and I’ll probably never do an Ultimate unless friends want to try and carry me. I ground out a Cosmic title, not for any “prestige,” but because it fit the persona of my character.

While I might appreciate the challenge of harder fights just to say “hey I did it, maybe I don’t totally suck,” that’s not my main focus, and didn’t seem to be the main focus of the game when I started. I’m not going to be part of the casual vs. hardcore divide going on: there’s nothing wrong with either side wanting things to do that fit their playstyle. But it can’t be denied that much of this expansion, the focus has shifted towards providing more challenging content, even in the story-level areas, and it’s totally understandable why people who consider themselves “casual,” in either skill or focus, feel like they’re being left behind.

When it comes to Forked Tower, to not have the Normal/Savage split so that both groups can feel like they are able to equally enjoy the culmination of the content feels bad. And I still think they should reconsider adding a Normal mode to this zone when they release the next zone, which they now say will have both. As I said in another thread, it’s like skipping to the last chapter of a book when the middle pages have been ripped out. In this instance, the casuals were totally left out, and it’s a huge step backwards after Bozja provided three story-level dungeons. So while it might be fun to watch someone getting the world’s first clear, a lot of people are just here for the story and the fun of it. By all means, continue making content for the more high-level players, but don’t leave everyone else out in the process.

[Mawlzy]

The only difference between a "casual" and "midcore" player is, that the "casual" player is still too scared to try things in my opinion.
But everyone slices these categories differently.

This is a common view that I've never understood. It's related to "stop holding yourself back," and "anyone can clear X hard content if they just do Y and Z."

The truth in most cases is much simpler. As soon as some of us see the word "prog," the immediate thought is "this is a game, not a job." Or we simply find PvE in this game tedious. Or a hundred other reasons that all boil down to "I'm not interested in that," not "I'm afraid of that."

Nothing to do with fear, in part because there are no consequences for failure.

[Rawazh]

You sure? I didn't knew that players not engaging with high level M+ keys can get their mount outside of M+.

These are bad faith arguments i'm seeing there
I'm not asking to get all the rewards from ultimate for free, i'm asking to be considered as a casual player or midcore player as well when it comes to good rewards.
When people doing savage get the highest ilvl weapons and gear, the mount, the dyable gear, i think it's ok to ask at least for the mount to drop in a normal difficulty but with a low drop rate equal to the mount that drop in extremes ?
Exactly like in wow?
People doing mythic have a 100% drop rate, while in LFR it's close to one pourcent, at least we get a chance to that ?
How is it unfair to ask to be considered as we were in shadowbringer?
I'm happy about your 67y/o player and his grandson doing DSR, but they are an exception here.

In WoW i can have some heroic gear in the game without going in heroic content, just by doing casual stuff that allow me to get it and upgrade it, it is slower, but at least i have a chance to get it - that doesn't stop you to enjoy the hard content and your rewards? isn't what you like most? a hard fight?
Why do you care if someone gets it in other ways? Shouldn't you be happy to see people enjoying things as well? Or are you doing all that just to feed an ego?
Of course wow is not perfect but at least they made an effort to let the game be engaging for their casual players, while still pleasing the hardcore gamers

Your argument about the mount available for m+ players is out of the entire point - while you do have a lot of rewards for engaging in hardcore parts of the game, there is literally nothing for the other players to get into in ff14 - That's the main problem, the money they use should be used to allow THE MAJOR PLAYERBASE to enjoy the game first, before the minority.

OC was a highly anticipated content from everyone, and AGAIN 80% of us are being denied the entrance of forked tower -"It's not that hard you just have to join a discord" this sentence shouldn't even exist in the first place .
How many chaos raid is there in the PF ?
I saw ONE yesterday that disbanded literally 20 minutes later - Everyone is saying the content is dead and no one is running it anymore, do you think it is normal?
If they lowered a bit the difficulty the raid would still be up today maintained by the midcore player base.

[FuturePastNow]

Yeah he's on Twitter right now saying crap like this because there's not a new Ultimate in 7.3

"FF14 went from a major turn around to become the best expansion in terms of amount content, into now possibly back to the EW slog era"

And I've seen similar sentiment from other streamers. Basically 7.3 has "nothing" because it doesn't have an Ultimate. They are so completely divorced from the actual player base and what the actual player base spends their time on. SE needs to stop listening to them.

That's very funny to me as a casual player because I was thinking the same thing. I get MSQ which will occupy me for a few hours, and I get Alliance Raid which will be tons of fun for one day but after that the rewards are limited to once per week (for no reason, the limitation is stupid).

I may or may not do the extreme and unreal, it depends on how hard they actually are. I can't do Forked Tower so I'm already done with OC until more jobs are added. I'll try the deep dungeon but I expect it to be a lazy copy and paste of EO which isn't interesting.