So how would you buff bard? (Just like to hear peoples thoughts)

[VentVanitas]

walking casts are fine in PvP lol. it's a different beast that has many different factors to consider from PvE. they force you to position carefully and commit to casts, which can be considered a necessary weakness for ranged jobs like BRD and MCH.

I am indifferent to the idea of walking casts in PvE, however. it does not have the same aforementioned factors that make walking casts enjoyable to me, as really all you need to do in PvE is to just stay alive and hit the boss. I think there's plenty of other ideas that can work just fine (and already have before) to make BRD more fun without having to borrow from PvP.

[Azurarok]

I wish they'd play into difficulty with phys ranged from a different angle than mobility restrictions since those are already things covered by melee and casters.

BRD I wish could play more into the constant party buff aspect, having to consider the optimal song to play at different moments based on party comp and content (That also requires breaking down the 2 minute meta of course). Buffers should be having to put in effort to think about how/when to use which buffs to maximize their output, not have the game automate it

[Valence]

Thing is, rphys used to have a real identity that wasn't based on mobility, even though I'd agree they actually tried to do this back in HW and meet halfway between casters and melees with a lot of weaves to be had in the tiny window after casts. But back then the game wasn't about DDR and running everywhere all the time either. No, they had more complicated toolkits, actual party support that everyone didn't have to have but better, and they were the proc based role, with way more refined priorities than what we have today.

walking casts are fine in PvP lol. it's a different beast that has many different factors to consider from PvE. they force you to position carefully and commit to casts, which can be considered a necessary weakness for ranged jobs like BRD and MCH.

I am indifferent to the idea of walking casts in PvE, however. it does not have the same aforementioned factors that make walking casts enjoyable to me, as really all you need to do in PvE is to just stay alive and hit the boss. I think there's plenty of other ideas that can work just fine (and already have before) to make BRD more fun without having to borrow from PvP.

Walking casts are the best way to kill yourself especially at high level. It doesn't forgive, and it doesn't provide you way enough benefits to be worth it, even if you still kinda want to use them at least a little.
In theory I'd agree with you but in practice, they feel unrewarding, and way, way more punishing than normal casts over which they hold no advantage (which is ironic). Yes, the slow movement isn't an advantage, it's like being under heavy, you'd be immobile it wouldn't change anything.

[Shurrikhan]

I wish they'd play into difficulty with phys ranged from a different angle than mobility restrictions since those are already things covered by melee and casters.

I mean, they exist as frequently as they do because, frankly, positional greeding is a fun lever to offer. (It's just a shame that, on melee especially, it's so rarely leveraged interestingly by modern fight design.) Designers can add whatever other complexities they like atop that, but it's virtually never a bad thing to provide more means of engagement and getting more cognitive load out of the positional concerns of a fight is a pretty great way to go about that.

Now, if one wanted a way to opt out of that, such as by cast-times or charge-ups being limited to a particular song that could be avoided with only some <10% dps loss or may have highly diminishing returns beyond fairly infrequently use... sure, that's great... so long as the lever remains. Just like skill-expression should probably allow for some element of difficulty through hitting things at the perfect time (some buffs to delay to end of gap, directs to use instantly, and apm dynamics enough to notice), preemption/planning, occasionally or at least situationally competing priorities, etc.

[Sindal]

You know what would be a neat QoL change

If, at some point during leveling, using your dot gives you a charge that turns the other dot into an Ogcd. That'll let you fire both in one gcd motion.

It'll make dotting up mobs a bit faster in dungeons, and speed up reapplying dots on single targets in the event you dropped them for some reason.

Heck you could tie it to songs if you want to be quirky.

During mages, poison will trigger wind ogcd
During army's, wind will trigger poison ogcd
During wanderers, either one will trigger the other

[Valence]

I mean, they exist as frequently as they do because, frankly, positional greeding is a fun lever to offer. (It's just a shame that, on melee especially, it's so rarely leveraged interestingly by modern fight design.) Designers can add whatever other complexities they like atop that, but it's virtually never a bad thing to provide more means of engagement and getting more cognitive load out of the positional concerns of a fight is a pretty great way to go about that.

Now, if one wanted a way to opt out of that, such as by cast-times or charge-ups being limited to a particular song that could be avoided with only some <10% dps loss or may have highly diminishing returns beyond fairly infrequently use... sure, that's great... so long as the lever remains. Just like skill-expression should probably allow for some element of difficulty through hitting things at the perfect time (some buffs to delay to end of gap, directs to use instantly, and apm dynamics enough to notice), preemption/planning, occasionally or at least situationally competing priorities, etc.

Positional greeding as a concept is literally why I main rphys, because I don't have to worry much about it, even if in terms of mobility (not uptime) the role is one of the worst in the game. I fundamentally dislike this, because it's directly tied to the DDR mentality of the game.
I'll gladly leave this to melees and casters.

[Azurarok]

Right, I kinda want each role to have their own challenges? Melees have positionals and limited range, Casters have cast times, Rangers should offer something else

They really should be doing more to differentiate Melees since they take 3 whole sets of armor too. Like what even is the difference between a slayer and striker at this point?

[Shurrikhan]

Positional greeding as a concept is literally why I main rphys, because I don't have to worry much about it, even if in terms of mobility (not uptime) the role is one of the worst in the game. I fundamentally dislike this, because it's directly tied to the DDR mentality of the game.
I'll gladly leave this to melees and casters.

That seems kinda... bizarre(?) to me, ngl. "Greeding" via risky or knowledge-demanding positioning is absolutely a thing in games with little to no "DDR", far more varied mechanics, far more interesting trash/adds, etc., and is at least as tied to forethought, tactical preemptive movement (rather than merely reactive), etc. Though this game refuses to ask enough from its melee to allow for such, in others, it's what makes me feel like I'm actually playing with and around a tank, instead of just occasionally hitting WASD to follow while beating striking dummies. I'd argue we need to leverage it further, not less, if you want the game to feel like it offers more than merely "DDR".

Right, I kinda want each role to have their own challenges? Melees have positionals and limited range, Casters have cast times, Rangers should offer something else

They really should be doing more to differentiate Melees since they take 3 whole sets of armor too. Like what even is the difference between a slayer and striker at this point?

But why should each gameplay aspect be locked to a single role type? Casts aren't locked to casters; SAM has had them since its inception, and is more unique for it. Melee attacks aren't locked to melee; RDM has had them since its inception, and is more unique for it. Defensives aren't locked to tanks, even if they've been increasingly homogenized among non-tanks (and tanks alike), and jobs are (or were) much more able to stand out diversely for that. Heals aren't locked to heals, and despite the vast excesses we have of healing relative to damage intake (an altogether separate matter that has to do with totals far, far more than it has anything to do with proportions), and jobs have variously had more flair and uniqueness for it (though here the better-done examples more include HW/StB DRK than EW+ WAR, Life Surge over Reply of Earth, etc.).

[Valence]

That seems kinda... bizarre(?) to me, ngl. "Greeding" via risky or knowledge-demanding positioning is absolutely a thing in games with little to no "DDR", far more varied mechanics, far more interesting trash/adds, etc., and is at least as tied to forethought, tactical preemptive movement (rather than merely reactive), etc. Though this game refuses to ask enough from its melee to allow for such, in others, it's what makes me feel like I'm actually playing with and around a tank, instead of just occasionally hitting WASD to follow while beating striking dummies. I'd argue we need to leverage it further, not less, if you want the game to feel like it offers more than merely "DDR".

Perhaps I jumped the gun and misunderstood a little. Positioning as in the older times I'm fine with actually. Picking up a nice position and sticking to it, until you have to get somewhere else is fine. Having to dance all around the place like a frog in a blender running from one safespot to another trying to dodge abstract geometry on the floor, is not to me. For instance, there is types of positioning that I do appreciate, I'd say something you could call closer to "tactical", like old tank positioning, mob positioning, ranged mobs vs melee mobs... I know we never had a high ground gameplay mechanic in XIV but you get the idea? That's i'm all for.

[Shurrikhan]

Perhaps I jumped the gun and misunderstood a little. Positioning as in the older times I'm fine with actually. Picking up a nice position and sticking to it, until you have to get somewhere else is fine. Having to dance all around the place like a frog in a blender running from one safespot to another trying to dodge abstract geometry on the floor, is not to me. For instance, there is types of positioning that I do appreciate, I'd say something you could call closer to "tactical", like old tank positioning, mob positioning, ranged mobs vs melee mobs... I know we never had a high ground gameplay mechanic in XIV but you get the idea? That's i'm all for.

Ahh, mostly agreed then. I'll just say that my favorite experiences on ranged classes have generally leveraged that range in ways that require me to thread a needle between uptime and positioning (especially where contextual and interdependent, such as in baiting enemy skills, making room, collapsing for AoE heals, and back, rather than just DDR), so I would hate to see the whole Ranger role here, as a rule, be prevented from interacting with range restrictions, cast times, piercing (thin linear AoE) shots, etc. just to prevent them from feeling "pressured" to manage their positioning in any way that'd cause cognitive load (to me... the core of engagement).