Tales from Duty Finder: Some make you laugh, some make you cry. Let's vent. 2.0

[Merrigan]

I'll probably get flak for this, but, while I admire your dedication, as someone who has played mostly DNC over the past several months, if I'm in a group with another DNC, I will not pay the slightest bit of attention to what they're doing and will make zero effort to coordinate with them. There is no content in the game where you would end up with two DNCs in which the time saved due to smart coordinating would be more than a handful of seconds, and, though I haven't done the math, I would not be remotely surprised if you actually lose group DPS because one DNC isn't using their burst rotation during two-minute windows. There's just no meaningful reward for the effort.

+. It's not nice not to reply in the chat, but it's an optimisation that's not at all dramatic for content like Aglaia.

the Tank tuned off stance cuz they didn't want to take damage.

Now this is something which is a tragedy. A hilarious tragedy, but a tragedy nonetheless.

[Cincierta]

I'll probably get flak for this, but, while I admire your dedication, as someone who has played mostly DNC over the past several months, if I'm in a group with another DNC, I will not pay the slightest bit of attention to what they're doing and will make zero effort to coordinate with them. There is no content in the game where you would end up with two DNCs in which the time saved due to smart coordinating would be more than a handful of seconds, and, though I haven't done the math, I would not be remotely surprised if you actually lose group DPS because one DNC isn't using their burst rotation during two-minute windows. There's just no meaningful reward for the effort.

If one dancer overwrites another dancers Tech Step early, the first dancer basically loses half their damage, Espirit stack gain, and potential Saber Dances, not to mention more party damage. Because of said dancer purposefully overwriting mine, we actually saw scales on Nald'thal and almost wiped since I'm guessing people in the run had not seen Scales for so long they almost forgot how it worked.

Please coordinate with your other dancers. That Tech Step damage staggering adds up A LOT.

[Silaryn]

I'll probably get flak for this, but, while I admire your dedication, as someone who has played mostly DNC over the past several months, if I'm in a group with another DNC, I will not pay the slightest bit of attention to what they're doing and will make zero effort to coordinate with them. There is no content in the game where you would end up with two DNCs in which the time saved due to smart coordinating would be more than a handful of seconds, and, though I haven't done the math, I would not be remotely surprised if you actually lose group DPS because one DNC isn't using their burst rotation during two-minute windows. There's just no meaningful reward for the effort.

You… you do realize the dancer staggering their tech step still uses their burst during the window, right? Tech step is the only move they’re staggering. I doubt extending the party-wide damage buff is an overall dps loss.

[TemporalFruitsAndVeggies]

If one dancer overwrites another dancers Tech Step early, the first dancer basically loses half their damage, Espirit stack gain, and potential Saber Dances, not to mention more party damage. Because of said dancer purposefully overwriting mine, we actually saw scales on Nald'thal and almost wiped since I'm guessing people in the run had not seen Scales for so long they almost forgot how it worked.

Please coordinate with your other dancers. That Tech Step damage staggering adds up A LOT.

I went back and read the tooltip again for Technical Finish, and I was quite wrong and you were quite right. Technical Finish does more than I realized.

I'm unconvinced on the magnitude of the difference it makes, though, especially in trivial content like Aglaia, but I'm not about to sit down and do the potency math in different group combinations. If someone else has done the math, I'd be happy to read through it. But ultimately I'm guessing it still just boils down to a handful of seconds.

That said, you have successfully converted me to a person who, if asked by another DNC to coordinate, will agree to coordinate. I would not go so far as to ask another DNC to coordinate.

You… you do realize the dancer staggering their tech step still uses their burst during the window, right? Tech step is the only move they’re staggering. I doubt extending the party-wide damage buff is an overall dps loss.

I mean you lose 2,900 potency in total during the two-minute window by delaying Technical Finish, but I guess your one-minute burst plus a Starfall Dance is still technically a burst, so, yeah, sure. Technically, the make-up 2,900 potency later will be weaker, too, because you won't have Devilment up for it.

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

Esprit buff stays even when two DNC overwrite their Technical. The 5% damage buff though? Yeah, they're gone.

I personally just move my Technical Step to odd numbered minutes when there's 2nd DNC in the party. That seems to be a better mileage considering there are still 1m job remaining + you also get your own Flourish window. Works like a charm half of the time for me. The other half is having that 2nd DNC drifts their Technical and still somehow ends up overwriting my odd minute Technical (probably they forgot until they see my technical and be like "Oh right I have this!").

Other than that, it's just unfortunate of an occasion for game to pair you with dupe jobs in general.

[Silaryn]

I went back and read the tooltip again for Technical Finish, and I was quite wrong and you were quite right. Technical Finish does more than I realized.

I'm unconvinced on the magnitude of the difference it makes, though, especially in trivial content like Aglaia, but I'm not about to sit down and do the potency math in different group combinations. If someone else has done the math, I'd be happy to read through it. But ultimately I'm guessing it still just boils down to a handful of seconds.

That said, you have successfully converted me to a person who, if asked by another DNC to coordinate, will agree to coordinate. I would not go so far as to ask another DNC to coordinate.



I mean you lose 2,900 potency in total during the two-minute window by delaying Technical Finish, but I guess your one-minute burst plus a Starfall Dance is still technically a burst, so, yeah, sure. Technically, the make-up 2,900 potency later will be weaker, too, because you won't have Devilment up for it.

You forgot Devilment but you could add Technical Finish to your “technically a burst” too. If you use Technical Step with 7 seconds left of the buff you can use Technical Finish within your devilment buff and the other dancer’s technical finish. It’s still a personal potency loss but I don’t think it’s as big of a potency loss as you think. At the end of my first post I meant overall group dps would not be lower, not personal dps. That’s my fault for not specifying.

Edit: I don’t think you intentionally left out Devilment I’m just including it for completion’s sake.

[VeyaAkemi]

If one dancer overwrites another dancers Tech Step early, the first dancer basically loses half their damage, Espirit stack gain, and potential Saber Dances, not to mention more party damage. Because of said dancer purposefully overwriting mine, we actually saw scales on Nald'thal and almost wiped since I'm guessing people in the run had not seen Scales for so long they almost forgot how it worked..

This is wrong, the only thing you lose by overlapping Tech Steps is the 5% damage buff for 20 seconds, red Esprit buff and the extra Saber Dances resulting from such buff will still be there, here's exactly how multiple DNC works:

Standard Step: Fully stack with each other, should there be an excess of DNC in the party, either in 4-player content, or 8-content where you got 3 or more DNC in the same party, DNC should Partner each other, but a third DNC will not stack with either of them, while they are visually identical, think of the Standard Step buff as "out"(that you apply to your Dance Partner) and "in"(that you apply to yourself), two "out" buffs can't stack, but an "in" and an "out" buff can.

Technical Step: The Esprit buff will stack, with both being active on the party and having independent procs, but the 5% damage buff will not.

Devilment: Devilment cannot stack with each other, in any situation, while this is an issue in 4-player content, in 8-player it will never be an issue unless you your party could be mistaken for a theater troupe.

If your alliance saw scales, it's not because of the singular instance of the a 5% buff got wasted, it's because your alliance sucked and you tried to look for a reason for it, so you pinned the blame on something that annoyed you, unless you were running on extremely thin DPS margins... which probably still means your alliance sucked.

[Shuuli]

I'll probably get flak for this, but, while I admire your dedication, as someone who has played mostly DNC over the past several months, if I'm in a group with another DNC, I will not pay the slightest bit of attention to what they're doing and will make zero effort to coordinate with them. There is no content in the game where you would end up with two DNCs in which the time saved due to smart coordinating would be more than a handful of seconds, and, though I haven't done the math, I would not be remotely surprised if you actually lose group DPS because one DNC isn't using their burst rotation during two-minute windows. There's just no meaningful reward for the effort.

Before SE made the changes to the LB charge, I did double DNC in UWU and it took us about 2 minutes to discuss who shields first and who uses our steps first. Thats about all you need if you have two dancer. But in casual content this should not be even a problem. Casual contetn is designed taht you can do it with any type of characters. We had Aglaia runs with only tanks first week xD

[MicahZerrshia]

After 15 years with this game I finally had one of those moments where I had an encounter with one of those players you hear about, but seldom actually see.

So, like many I am bored and am leveling an alt for laughs. I get into Cutter Cry and just before the second boss, the tank runs into one of the sand things and leaves me, the healer, with the 2 dps. I sleep the mobs, they wake them up, I sleep them, they wake them up, I sleep them, they wake them up. You get the idea. So deaths happen and I just went into the boss. I said, "Sleeping only works if you don't wake the mobs" Which I was told in reply to then tell the party what I was doing. I wasnt sure why I had to since they clearly saw me spamming repose, so you think common sense would kick in and they would stop fighting since the mobs were wiping the floor with them, but sadly no.

So, I thought I would be silly and on the final boss I said. "Just letting you know, for this boss I will be healing, maybe some dps." then there was a mech I had to run from and I said, "Now I'm running!" again I thought I was being cute, maybe a lil funny. What was the reply I got? "Yeah, your mouth! Go back to WoW!" and they left lol.

I mean, it was so funny. You hear these stories about overly sensitive, humorless and fragile players, but man its rare you run into one. Made me chuckle at least.

[Merrigan]

After 15 years with this game I finally had one of those moments where I had an encounter with one of those players you hear about, but seldom actually see.

So, like many I am bored and am leveling an alt for laughs. I get into Cutter Cry and just before the second boss, the tank runs into one of the sand things and leaves me, the healer, with the 2 dps. I sleep the mobs, they wake them up, I sleep them, they wake them up, I sleep them, they wake them up. You get the idea. So deaths happen and I just went into the boss. I said, "Sleeping only works if you don't wake the mobs" Which I was told in reply to then tell the party what I was doing. I wasnt sure why I had to since they clearly saw me spamming repose, so you think common sense would kick in and they would stop fighting since the mobs were wiping the floor with them, but sadly no.

So, I thought I would be silly and on the final boss I said. "Just letting you know, for this boss I will be healing, maybe some dps." then there was a mech I had to run from and I said, "Now I'm running!" again I thought I was being cute, maybe a lil funny. What was the reply I got? "Yeah, your mouth! Go back to WoW!" and they left lol.

I mean, it was so funny. You hear these stories about overly sensitive, humorless and fragile players, but man its rare you run into one. Made me chuckle at least.

They probably didn't see you do it. When you do your rotation, you don't necessarily have time to hold your finger back when you see the ‘sleep’ status displayed on the mob. Their fault? Partly. We're dealing with players who don't look at your status bar and your cast. But it's a bit like one of those cases where the DRK uses LD, while the whm at the same time thinks it would be cool to slap benediction at the same time: nobody's fault, poor coordination and not necessarily paying attention, which is pretty normal in an instance you've done hundreds of times.

So er... Without wanting to be too controversial or unpleasant, I think you should have made it clear at the time. Or simply heal them by abandoning the idea of sleep, which is possible at this level (from memory, it works without a tank in this dungeon. Unless the pack was huge).