Chaotic is midcore, in case you were wondering

[Lilapop]

Why are we suddenly considering extremes and Savages midcore? Will Ultimates be midcore next?

[OlafQuintessa]

Why are we suddenly considering extremes and Savages midcore? Will Ultimates be midcore next?

Because that's what the lead battle designer said in an interview: “During the 6.x era, we received a lot of player feedback regarding a lack of midcore content, as well as a strong desire for more large-scale content. The chaotic alliance raid is our direct response to these requests. With that in mind, we decided our target audience would primarily be those who fall somewhere between extreme trials and the first two savage encounters.."

[Bonoki]

Why are we suddenly considering extremes and Savages midcore? Will Ultimates be midcore next?

I have already seen some people call Futures Rewritten mid-core solely because of the high clear rates. Most raiders already view UCoB, UwU, and TEA as mid-core solely because of their age and how long everything has been solved and optimized into the ground. Like most things, it always comes down to context and perspective. By this logic, nothing with age can stay hardcore and will reduce to casual status. Savage is no different. For the first two weeks, it's viewed as Hardcore. By week 8, it's Mid-core. It seems most things are launched as hardcore and degrade to mid-core, then finally casual. And this only happens because of a surplus of available community resources and general player skills. The more tools there are to clear something, the less hardcore it's perceived.

[Jeeqbit]

Why are we suddenly considering extremes and Savages midcore? Will Ultimates be midcore next?

Because there are a lot of extremes that you can just coast through, follow a dorito for or get a lot of rez through. Let me think of some past examples:

• Limitless Blue Extreme (I legit farmed that in Duty Finder in HW as a newish tank)
• Sophia Extreme (honestly this was rough if the healers weren't good or the tanks didn't know what swaps are, but you could beat it with deaths and you can follow a dorito for it)
• Pool of Tribute Extreme (meme was that everyone 1 shot this and healed through it, MINE runs are still 1 shots)
• Emanation Extreme (kinda got a bit more to it? But it wasn't seen as a big hurdle at the time and I even cleared it in Mentor Roulette once with randoms)
• Great Hunt Extreme (tbh I tried teaching this when it released and it was hopeless because they had to leave when I'd taught them most of the mechs, but I've cleared it with randoms and sprouts almost 30 times in Mentor Roulette)
• Byakko Extreme (literally cleared this in 3 pulls on release, similar story with the Unreal version, it's insanely forgiving, also cleared it with sprouts MINE sometimes in 1 pull or in the full timer)
• Suzaku Extreme (this was more intimidating in PF but due to the release of Red Mages, they and healers were able to carry parties through with loads of deaths, so it was ultimately realistic to prog through to a clear.)
• Seiryu Extreme (again, due to the release of Red Mage, the unlimited rez just makes the whole thing kinda trivial even with deaths and vulns)
• Dark Inside Extreme (if you followed the dorito you could clear barely knowing the fight, tanks only needed to know the swap)
• Mothercrystal Extreme (rougher than the previous one, some people will see it as hard but kinda boring to me personally, I joined to help full parties of new endgame players clear it successfully within the timer)
• Innocence Extreme (total joke, full parties of sprouts can 1 or 2 shot this, come on)
• Dancing Plague Extreme (required prog, very mechanical, but very realistic to clear as a parties of sprouts within the timer tbh, it's fun but wasn't hard imo)
• Cinder Drift Extreme (the checkpoint halfway through made it a total joke to clear and with good DPS lots of the first phase got skipped, just needed tanks to know what tanking is)
• Final Day Extreme (a lot of people think this was hard but you could dorito a lot of it, luck out, rez a lot, it was forgiving enough that if you had the capability to learn then you'd get through it eventually. Tanks could solo through half the fight)
• Storm's Crown Extreme (half of people think this was hard, others would see it as easy, I found it easy but half the parties I joined thought it was "hard", ultimately if they progged through the whole timer they'd probably clear it)
• Mount Ordeals Extreme (insanely trivial and boring, the most important bits you could dorito, rez or healer LB3, then you could skip the hardest bit Limit Cut at the end with enough DPS)
• (You know what, I'll skip Voidcast Daiz because a lot of people couldn't do Double Meteor much less Gales2)
• Abyssal Fracture Extreme (I was the dorito in many first time clear parties and I helped so many people clear due to myself doing this so, it had a hard bit for many in meteor placement but it wasn't really that hard tbh). I do feel like the stuff after was hard as well and easy to get killed as a DPS, so maybe this one isn't quite so midcore, but the amount of people I helped clear this says otherwise - easier to help them clear than Voidcast Daiz was.
• Valigarmanda Extreme (depending on the party, you will either just prog pretty far but not clear or it'll be a total joke even if you die and skip stuff, it's meant for people that never did an Ex before)

[BigCheez]

Why are we suddenly considering extremes and Savages midcore? Will Ultimates be midcore next?

Because it is midcore content. You can approach extreme/savage very casually and still clear while it's relevant. Ultimate is not midcore because it has gear requirements and requires a much higher degree of planning and coordination to clear.

If you're looking for duty finder-friendly content that can be beaten in one session by anyone who queues up, that's casual content.

Casual:
Dungeons, Trials, Normal Raids, Alliance Raids, Exploration Zones, Deep Dungeons, Variant Dungeons

Midcore:
Extreme, Unreal, Savage, Criterion, Chaotic

Hardcore:
Ultimate, Criterion (Savage)

There's some leeway here because a group could have a hardcore approach to savage and clear in the first few days, but generally speaking - this is the split of content in FFXIV.

[MrJPtheAssassin]

Because it is midcore content. You can approach extreme/savage very casually and still clear while it's relevant. Ultimate is not midcore because it has gear requirements and requires a much higher degree of planning and coordination to clear.

If you're looking for duty finder-friendly content that can be beaten in one session by anyone who queues up, that's casual content.

Casual:
Dungeons, Trials, Normal Raids, Alliance Raids, Exploration Zones, Deep Dungeons, Variant Dungeons

Midcore:
Extreme, Unreal, Savage, Criterion, Chaotic

Hardcore:
Ultimate, Criterion (Savage)

There's some leeway here because a group could have a hardcore approach to savage and clear in the first few days, but generally speaking - this is the split of content in FFXIV.

Most of those I would agree with but Savage and Chaotic. I think Savage lends closer to Hardcore bc you still need a lot of time investment to clear the fights, especially in PF and the same goes for Chaotic. That said I don't think Chaotic sololy lands in either, I think it's somewhere in the middle of mid-core to hardcore. The main reason why I say this is because of how much time it actually takes to clear this fight in a pf setting. I have finally gotten around progging it and most of my time progging has been spent in waiting in parties than the actually fight. One hour of waiting for 24 ppl to join and then after 3 or 4 wipes ppl leave and then back to waiting again. Imo mid-core content is content that can be cleared in a pf in like an evening or two, that is why I think EXs are mid-core bc most ppl I feel can clear an EX in two or three days. Savage on the other hand can take a week or more and Chaotic is more or less the same. I don't know, I just personally don't see savage and Chaotic as purely mid-core content since you do need to study some and spend a decent amount of time progging in a PF setting.

[CaedemSanguis]

Most of those I would agree with but Savage and Chaotic. I think Savage lends closer to Hardcore bc you still need a lot of time investment to clear the fights, especially in PF and the same goes for Chaotic. That said I don't think Chaotic sololy lands in either, I think it's somewhere in the middle of mid-core to hardcore. The main reason why I say this is because of how much time it actually takes to clear this fight in a pf setting. I have finally gotten around progging it and most of my time progging has been spent in waiting in parties than the actually fight. One hour of waiting for 24 ppl to join and then after 3 or 4 wipes ppl leave and then back to waiting again. Imo mid-core content is content that can be cleared in a pf in like an evening or two, that is why I think EXs are mid-core bc most ppl I feel can clear an EX in two or three days. Savage on the other hand can take a week or more and Chaotic is more or less the same. I don't know, I just personally don't see savage and Chaotic as purely mid-core content since you do need to study some and spend a decent amount of time progging in a PF setting.

"Most of those I would agree with but Savage and Chaotic. I think Savage lends closer to Hardcore bc you still need a lot of time investment to clear the fights"

have you ever done P1s ? E1s ? E5s ? P6s ? P11s ? It's really not that far from Sphene EX, even easier sometime

[Collin_Sky]

"Most of those I would agree with but Savage and Chaotic. I think Savage lends closer to Hardcore bc you still need a lot of time investment to clear the fights"

have you ever done P1s ? E1s ? E5s ? P6s ? P11s ? It's really not that far from Sphene EX, even easier sometime

Why ask a question you know the answer to? Of course they haven't.