Why casual players don't 'just leave'

[Lilapop]

Well I dont think it will ever change until you guys stop subbing when no content

If I was a casual, i'll only sub 1 month/expansion

"casuals should stop subbing until they get what they want"
"if i was a casual i would sub ... "

I'll wait until you see it.

[CaedemSanguis]

"casuals should stop subbing until they get what they want"
"if i was a casual i would sub ... "

I'll wait until you see it.

oh yeah 1 month sub is equal to 24-30 months

you're a joke

[Absurdity]

Which leads us to today. Let's take a look and see what other MMO games there are for these casuals to play?

• WoW: Has long since collapsed into a 'compete or die' black hole. Dubious past, future after TLT uncertain.

No idea where you got that one from. Having recently played TWiW, it is probably the most casual friendly WoW has ever been.
I can jump into solo Delves any time I want and get normal raid level gear provided I have bountiful coffer keys (basically the weekly lockout system for delves), do a few solo delves at tier 8 and you get a piece of heroic raid level gear from the Vault next reset. You can even turn those items into tier set pieces with the catalyst.

As for the open world, that had a ton of stuff to do since Dragonflight.

FFXIV is the only MMO game that fits these following critera:

1. Game is still receiving updates, and isn't actively being sunset.
2. Game has a substantial pool of people to interact with.
3. Game actually has an immersive world to engage with.

The last time this game came even close to having an immersive world was ARR, and even that is a stretch.

[NegativeS]

[/LIST]No idea where you got that one from. Having recently played TWiW, it is probably the most casual friendly WoW has ever been.
I can jump into solo Delves any time I want and get normal raid level gear provided I have bountiful coffer keys (basically the weekly lockout system for delves), do a few solo delves at tier 8 and you get a piece of heroic raid level gear from the Vault next reset. You can even turn those items into tier set pieces with the catalyst.

As for the open world, that had a ton of stuff to do since Dragonflight.



[/LIST]The last time this game came even close to having an immersive world was ARR, and even that is a stretch.

Was more referring to the setting rather than the actual in-game open world, but I see where you're coming from.

[Absurdity]

Was more referring to the setting rather than the actual in-game open world, but I see where you're coming from.

I would agree with the immersive setting up until around Endwalker. Shadowbringers had the whole time travel AU thing going on and that was honestly already dodgy.
But Endwalker came in swinging with the comic relief rabbits to escape the end of the universe, the aether powered space ship, the "good primals", the end of days happening in a whopping two zones, the inifinite power of friendship, everything is and was actually just Ancients or Ascians... I could go on.

Needless to say that expansion killed my immersion.

[Lilapop]

oh yeah 1 month sub is equal to 24-30 months

you're a joke

And what you said is the punchline.

[CaedemSanguis]

And what you said is the punchline.

Anyway thank you for paying for my content, hopefully yoshi will make more raider content and even less casual content, keep going

[Shougun]

Somehow still have that ARR rise from the phoenix glasses on, but they're growing fainter by the minute these days. There are many things to still like, but I feel, for what I like, the game has been caught by a black hole and is just slowly slipping away. Hardly ever an improvement that really gets the blood flowing, except for the things I'd say already did that. Like yeah I think the graphics look good, yeah I think the updated zones look good, but I also /already/ thought the game looked good. So we're at like what 95% and went to 97%?

Meanwhile the thing that I have dearly wished improved, for.. years (am I crazy.. yes probably), definitely gets worse each year instead or done in a way that makes me think of this:



Seeing WoW to some extent take the major benefits of our job system, and smooth out edges, has made me give it a try, and it just solidifies the feeling that FFXIV is running on chigoe molts while WoW is grabbing the nearest mako and pumping it into the vein (again, not perfect- their recent patch had a hilarious number of bugs, but they were fixed and you can see the 'better path' is continuing in their future content too.. so if they don't squirrel off and keep their energy it doesn't look good to me for FFXIV). FFXIV will definitely not die, but it sucks to go from a long time player who is like "FFXIV is just better" to be like "Yeah it's alright, great graphics and music! But have you heard of the critically acclaimed game, WoW?". Whoever was instructed to play their competition back in ARR must have moved onto new games, that or they stuffed their ears, blindfolded themselves, or were hamstrung by budget / employee workforce constraints.

"What does FFXIV do better?" Imo, graphics, story, and music are still better. However I would say my memory of WoW being kind of meh looking isn't entirely accurate, the newer zones can be quite pretty and the zone design makes up for it (zone content is substantially better than FFXIV). The story is a little improved but the amount of it is like... 5 hours for the whole expansion lol.

Anyway, genuinely feel concerned about the long term direction this game continues to take when it comes to GAMEPLAY components. I'm never going to worry about the music or art. Yes, yes, I am aware of hroth hats or whatever, but its low on my list of concerns - like very low, except for I believe they should ensure all seasonal, all MSQ specific "capstone" rewards, and cashshop always work, the rest.. .do it when you can or whatever, it's probably going to look silly anyways lol. Like a Worgen with a hat, oof - I've been not hatting since release.


Someone(s) please wake up and get hungry :/

[AvoSturmfaust]

I think the real full Casuals are the biggest issue FFXIV are facing right now and they really should leave and dont get me wrong i dont mean it in a bad or mean way BUT listen to me im talking about the Casuals which doesnt want to take part in any real combat content, or crafting or farming content or anything, look i play MMOs for more then 15-17years now, i played from Metin2 to Rappelz, Flyff, Perfect World, Blade and Soul, Tera, Aion etc i played literally everything

In every game the Endgamecontent was always raids or bigger grinds or even crafting or farming what ever but it was content were people had to improve, learn a playstyle or anything you know, you had to do something for succes it wasnt "i want everything for free and dont wanna participate in content" and you had from hardcore player to casuals everything and everyone did the content but here in final its different

you have people which literally dont wanna do anything, i mean i get it if you dont wanna raid savage its fine there are still extremes or you can make millions with crafting, but there are people which really dont wanna do anything, no savage, no fates, no crafting, no farming, no grinding, no extremes, heck even dungeons are too hard for them but these people are complaining now there is no content for them,sorry to tell you but if even a dungeon is to hard for you, maybe mmos are not suited for you

and now there will be people starting with "but this people are the majority and they pay the game" but no they arent the majority, i guarantee you combine the savage raider, the casuals which atleast enjoy extremes add the ones which enjoy purely crafting etc and you will see that casuals which doesnt want to participate in any content are the minority

and i say it again i mean now only these kind of people who really dont wanna do anything like i said there are many many many casuals which do enjoy extremes or crafting or grinding

and i think final cant evolve because they created a bubble with people which doesnt want to participate in endgamecontent, never saw something in any mmo i played in the past

a game cant improve if hold back by the player.

[Kaurhz]

I think the real full Casuals are the biggest issue FFXIV are facing right now and they really should leave and dont get me wrong i dont mean it in a bad or mean way BUT listen to me im talking about the Casuals which doesnt want to take part in any real combat content, or crafting or farming content or anything, look i play MMOs for more then 15-17years now, i played from Metin2 to Rappelz, Flyff, Perfect World, Blade and Soul, Tera, Aion etc i played literally everything

In every game the Endgamecontent was always raids or bigger grinds or even crafting or farming what ever but it was content were people had to improve, learn a playstyle or anything you know, you had to do something for succes it wasnt "i want everything for free and dont wanna participate in content" and you had from hardcore player to casuals everything and everyone did the content but here in final its different

you have people which literally dont wanna do anything, i mean i get it if you dont wanna raid savage its fine there are still extremes or you can make millions with crafting, but there are people which really dont wanna do anything, no savage, no fates, no crafting, no farming, no grinding, no extremes, heck even dungeons are too hard for them but these people are complaining now there is no content for them,sorry to tell you but if even a dungeon is to hard for you, maybe mmos are not suited for you

and now there will be people starting with "but this people are the majority and they pay the game" but no they arent the majority, i guarantee you combine the savage raider, the casuals which atleast enjoy extremes add the ones which enjoy purely crafting etc and you will see that casuals which doesnt want to participate in any content are the minority

and i say it again i mean now only these kind of people who really dont wanna do anything like i said there are many many many casuals which do enjoy extremes or crafting or grinding

and i think final cant evolve because they created a bubble with people which doesnt want to participate in endgamecontent, never saw something in any mmo i played in the past

a game cant improve if hold back by the player.

Honestly, whilst you're coming from a good place, I do actually disagree. A social atmosphere is just as much a staple of an MMO as to what the general content is, so I think it's fine if players want to treat it as a social hub of sorts. Granted, it is a problem for people wanting something from nothing, but this isn't really exclusive to the casuals, I have seen so many people, both casual and hardcore defend the shallow husk that is now the FFXIV crafting system. FFXIV is just in a weird place because bar relics, the developers don't actually know how to create long-form content which is a massive problem.

I do agree with you that casuals that treat it as a social hub probably are the minority, but honestly you could remove every single 1 of them right now and not much will improve, because the problem with the game isn't actually the player, it is the developers. Just look at the amount of pure distaste people have for the rigid patch cycle, for example, yet they have persisted to do this expansion-after-expansion, unrelenting, and it isn't the casuals that don't want to engage with the game that are the problem here. Look at the amount of feedback they are getting, and watch how much of it will just be ignored.