Why do casual players seem entitled to cosmetic items added in game?

[Tyintheron]

That's kinda why I wouldn't mind Trusts for Trials & Raids, because at least I got to see the story even if the rewards were minimal/zero, and if I DID want to do the "proper" version for the full/any rewards, at least I know what I'm in for that a guide or video can't do because doing is better than showing sometimes ...BUT that would require redoing said Trials & Raids to be doable by NPCs, and absolutely nobody wants that apparently (which is understandable)

I keep hoping for two things from trusts: trials/raids required for story progression, and the ability to just have non-player slots filled in with NPCs so my wife and I can slog through whatever content we'd like together without needing to feel like we're klutzing it up for everyone else.

Clinging to the multiplayer side of things being necessary is feeling more and more like one of those "because that's how it's ALWAYS been!" types of arguments. This game's 10 years old. The genre itself is, what... 40, 50 years old? It's probably okay to provide more options by now without The King of Multiplayer Video Games getting angry about it.

[Supersnow845]

I keep hoping for two things from trusts: trials/raids required for story progression, and the ability to just have non-player slots filled in with NPCs so my wife and I can slog through whatever content we'd like together without needing to feel like we're klutzing it up for everyone else.

Clinging to the multiplayer side of things being necessary is feeling more and more like one of those "because that's how it's ALWAYS been!" types of arguments. This game's 10 years old. The genre itself is, what... 40, 50 years old? It's probably okay to provide more options by now without The King of Multiplayer Video Games getting angry about it.

“Clinging to old ways”

My brother in Christ it’s an MMO, do you understand what those three words stand for

It’s like walking into a pizza place and wondering why they only make pizza and declaring it’s because “they’ve always done it this way”

[Mawlzy]

“Clinging to old ways”

My brother in Christ it’s an MMO, do you understand what those three words stand for

It’s like walking into a pizza place and wondering why they only make pizza and declaring it’s because “they’ve always done it this way”

Probably pointless relitigating what "MMO" actually means, what it should mean, and what it could mean. That said, the evolution of the genre has seen the practical definition move away from "group content" to an increasing amount of "solo content in a world of other players." Many couples have requested the ability to play together and have the light party filled by NPCs. It has no negative impact on anyone else.

This is why many of us find content requiring statics and party finder to be quaint.

[Supersnow845]

Probably pointless relitigating what "MMO" actually means, what it should mean, and what it could mean. That said, the evolution of the genre has seen the practical definition move away from "group content" to an increasing amount of "solo content in a world of other players." Many couples have requested the ability to play together and have the light party filled by NPCs. It has no negative impact on anyone else.

This is why many of us find content requiring statics and party finder to be quaint.

In a game like 14 how would moving to “solo in a world of other players” maintain any semblance of interaction. The player economy is useless in this game, if content can be done solo it’s always more efficient to do it solo

In other games that are more solo friendly than 14 there is still stronger degrees of interaction because either they still force you to interact with the player economy or they still lock meaningful rewards behind group content

Attempting to do a similar thing in 14 would just kill everything instantly as you’d basically be playing solo in a world of dynamic NPC’s because the rest of what makes an MMO interactive has already been ripped out of 14

It’s contrived to say in the 14 forum but if you don’t want to play with other players you may not like them an MMO is not the game for you

[Mawlzy]

In a game like 14 how would moving to “solo in a world of other players” maintain any semblance of interaction. The player economy is useless in this game, if content can be done solo it’s always more efficient to do it solo

In other games that are more solo friendly than 14 there is still stronger degrees of interaction because either they still force you to interact with the player economy or they still lock meaningful rewards behind group content

Attempting to do a similar thing in 14 would just kill everything instantly as you’d basically be playing solo in a world of dynamic NPC’s because the rest of what makes an MMO interactive has already been ripped out of 14

It makes the degree of interaction a choice, thereby appealing to a broader demographic.

It's not something that appeals to me, but a game that includes an active venue scene and (E)RP surely has more than a "semblance of interaction."

[Tyintheron]

I think the moment my own old ass "finally got it" was during one Steam sale a year and a half ago when I opted to buy an outfit in Final Fantasy 14 over a new game (they were the same price), because I would get more "mileage" out of said cosmetic than the title presented to me at discount.

"HOW? WHY?" are the obvious questions... but I just point to my large backlog of other Steam games bought on sale and there you go. At the time I was far more invested in playing Final Fantasy 14, so the idea of spending anything outside of it seemed like a "wasted purchase" regardless of the supposed worth of a full and complete one-time purchase versus something cute for my catgirl to wear every so often.

My wife and I did/do the whole RP thing in the MMOs we play together, so most of our play and purchase decisions actually revolve around that, which... y'know. I get it. We're nerds.

But I do things that are "out of spec" in a lot of ways because RP means the goals of our gameplay are different. I don't really care about gear progression outside of it being a means to an end - the "end" being, specifically, how my character(s) look.

As an example: I earned one of the seasonal PvP sets six seperate times on six different alts.

If they had've had that set up on the store instead I would've bought it.

But I'm sure some people would still class me as "casual" due to a lack of raid progression.

This "us or them" stuff about defining exactly what category a player falls into so you can then tell them what they want from the game is clearly "wrong" has always seemed incredibly weird and bizarrely hostile.

[Tyintheron]

“Clinging to old ways”

My brother in Christ it’s an MMO, do you understand what those three words stand for

It’s like walking into a pizza place and wondering why they only make pizza and declaring it’s because “they’ve always done it this way”

I definitely don't know what MMO stands for, you're right. I always just assumed it was games for Moms, just spelled wrong, but thanks to your post I've learned that was incorrect!

I mean, I think. You didn't really clarify.

But I do think there are at least a couple of steps in your analogy you're missing to make that an equivalent example.

For example: does this pizza place also make you share 7 slices of your 8 slice pizza with 7 random strangers who react angrily to you "doing it wrong" before taking a vote to kick you out of the place?

Does the pizza parlor require that I wear 8 seperate pieces of clothing and accessories of a minimum quality before I can step inside?

If I approach the pizza parlor with my wife for a date, will it tell me that I can eat the pizza alone OR with 7 strangers, but not JUST with my wife?

I think a pizza parlor set up to follow MMO requirements would probably only have a 1-star rating on Yelp, that's for sure.

...

...what were we talking about, again..?

Right. Yeah. So - yes. I think that encouraging the introduction of quality-of-life features is more important than going with "it's always been this way before." Bear in mind that I'll be prepared to accept that this is your genuine stance ONLY if you're still angrily holding a candle for 1.0's "anima" system, where you couldn't really play the game meaningfully any more once you ran out.

Which, if so - I mean, way to hold to your convictions, my friend!

But I'd like to think that maybe you can agree that some things that are "staples of the genre" can actually be bad, or un-fun, and - if not outright removed - alternatives can be offered for people who won't otherwise interact with those systems in their current forms anyway.