Chaotic existing silenced all the complaints about PCT being op

[Aco505]

The fight has just been released. There's no perfect strats when it comes to positions, and most people are not going to optimize buff windows and timings, which can hurt a job like PCT who enjoys buffing and getting buffed. Plus several 2-minute windows fall at inconvenient times and require thought as to their use.

Judging the performance of some jobs right now is early, imho, but we do see some non-buffing jobs do better precisely because they're unaffected by arena positions and strats.

[Carighan]

Like honesty what? Like how did you make about 4 conflicting points in one sentence

Yeah well, I can explain things to you, but I can't understand them for you.

So let's simplify in an attempt:
Were Warriors maybe not too strong in PvE raids because in PvP it wasn't a problem? Yes or no?

[Supersnow845]

Yeah well, I can explain things to you, but I can't understand them for you.

So let's simplify in an attempt:
Were Warriors maybe not too strong in PvE raids because in PvP it wasn't a problem? Yes or no?

That’s not the statement you made. You specifically said “PCT was overpowered in chaotic” but “the content design hid it” and even if it didn’t hide it it’s pointless having overpowered jobs in CAR. So which is it? Is it overpowered? If so how is it overpowered considering it’s below all 6 melees and BLM

That has literally nothing to do with PCT still being overpowered in FRU because PCT is categorically not overpowered in Chaotic no matter which way you attempt to manipulate the data

Is it still too powerful in FRU- yes
Does this have anything to do with it decidedly not overpowered in chaotic- no

[Carighan]

Were Warriors maybe not too strong in PvE raids because in PvP it wasn't a problem? Yes or no?

(I'm trying to poke you at that Pictomancer is overpowered, the job. It doesn't matter where you place them. Their overpoweredness shows in a different way and to a different degree, but they're OP all the same, because it's the job itself that is, not the content around it)

[Supersnow845]

Were Warriors maybe not too strong in PvE raids because in PvP it wasn't a problem? Yes or no?

(I'm trying to poke you at that Pictomancer is overpowered, the job. It doesn't matter where you place them. Their overpoweredness shows in a different way and to a different degree, but they're OP all the same, because it's the job itself that is, not the content around it)

If you want to say it’s overpowered in x content then say it’s overpowered in x content, saying WAR doesn’t “feel overpowered” in PVE because it’s not overpowered in PVP is a nothing statement because in essence you are saying nothing at all.

PCT IS overpowered in FRU, PCT ISNT overpowered in CAR, hell PCT is one nerf away from near unviable in CAR given how close it is to RDM and SMN

a job doesn’t just become overpowered at everything because it’s overpowered at one thing. There is literally zero aspects of CAR PCT excels at

If you want to say “I’m tired because they still haven’t nerfed PCT in FRU” then just say that, this weird “the jobs nebulous existence is overpowered so it’s overpowered by default in content we have evidence it’s not” adds nothing to the argument

[Aysin]

I'd argue PCT is still as OP in CAR but it doesn't show because the amount of variables it has, that deter any type of optimization for synergy-based class to shine as much as they normally do. You can argue that CAR design is a weak point to PCT, because it is sort of true since I don't see almost anyone holding buffs for the damage amp phase of the raid, but classes like BLM who naturally align a buff window thanks to 2nd leylines into the amp window skews the result. All this because as people mentioned, there is no need to try so hard, the fight is entirely a mechanic check.

I guarantee if you have an alliance raid that agreed to send the real opener 30 seconds into the fight, right when the damage amp window is applied to the boss you will see PCT creep its way back to near the top, in fact you slightly see this when you sort by max in the statistics. Someone else previously mentioned that the raid hides PCTs power better than savage and FRU does, and I'd have to agree. I don't want balance around the 24man though so I'd rather we ignore these results, and just let it be a chaotic mechanic check because this is far more fun.

[Azurarok]

Unless yall want jobs to practically be glamour I think they've got to balance them around some content and end up with some imbalances in others. So should it be Savage raids, Chaotic, or Ultimates? I think it should be Savage

[Supersnow845]

I'd argue PCT is still as OP in CAR but it doesn't show because the amount of variables it has, that deter any type of optimization for synergy-based class to shine as much as they normally do. You can argue that CAR design is a weak point to PCT, because it is sort of true since I don't see almost anyone holding buffs for the damage amp phase of the raid, but classes like BLM who naturally align a buff window thanks to 2nd leylines into the amp window skews the result. All this because as people mentioned, there is no need to try so hard, the fight is entirely a mechanic check.

I guarantee if you have an alliance raid that agreed to send the real opener 30 seconds into the fight, right when the damage amp window is applied to the boss you will see PCT creep its way back to near the top, in fact you slightly see this when you sort by max in the statistics. Someone else previously mentioned that the raid hides PCTs power better than savage and FRU does, and I'd have to agree. I don't want balance around the 24man though so I'd rather we ignore these results, and just let it be a chaotic mechanic check because this is far more fun.

How else are you meant to de-emphasise a massive burster than forcibly misalign the burst window

Like is BLM actually OP but FRU “hides” it because it emphasises the burst window?

[AmiableApkallu]

Unless y'all want jobs to practically be glamour I think they've got to balance them around some content and end up with some imbalances in others.

Fair enough. But one might also ask why an Ultimate, of all the difficulty levels, features so much "stand around doing nothing" time. Why, in this one case, does the job get all the blame and not the content design, or some mix of the two? Neither exists in a vacuum.

[Wayfinder3]

Fair enough. But one might also ask why an Ultimate, of all the difficulty levels, features so much "stand around doing nothing" time. Why, in this one case, does the job get all the blame and not the content design, or some mix of the two? Neither exists in a vacuum.

Ultimate is the content that affects the least amount of people. Job inbalances might affect the experience but given we only get like 1-2 every 3 or so years, it’s hardly that big of a deal in the grand scheme of things. Picto could be busted in this ultimate and the next one and that wouldn’t really matter all that much. The main issue I have is if they tune the fights around picto’s design as opposed to altering some aspects of the picto or the other jobs to be similar to picto. If we’re adjusting fights to suit individual classes, we’ve gone too far.