Tales from Duty Finder: Some make you laugh, some make you cry. Let's vent. 2.0

[SeriousPan]

Not really if you were doing your best to understand how you died and tried to do better each time. It does irk me when a healer has a chance to actually have to do some serious healing to ensure a party members safety, something that a lot of healers want to be in this game, and then they don't embrace the challenge. Hopefully your next run goes better.

[CamuiKushi]

It went a lot better! Still made some mistakes, but I picked up the mechanics pretty quickly, I think only one death the whole raid ������
Made sure to thank the healers (there were quite a few deaths generally) and comm'd one of them XD

[Merrigan]

Is it wrong to expect spot healing when I fail mechanics? The first boss of the raid has a pretty nasty dot and even with self healing I wasn't able to make it through the next raidwide. After dying 3 times and being left on the floor after the third I decided to just eat the 30 min penalty and leave.

It depends. In general, I favour newcomers in a run as much as possible. But new or not, you never come before the survival of the whole group, never before the healer or the tank + there are times when that's impossible. On this boss, if you die from the damage inflicted after his punch, the problem most of the time is that people are dispatched and you're therefore inaccessible. The time it takes to run towards you, even with a dash, and you're dead. There are also potential mana problems, etc.

In short, it's... Hard to say, without more context. I don't really like untimely leaves though, but once again it's impossible to know if you were too impatient unless you specify how long you were left on the ground.

[CamuiKushi]

Ah, to add more context I seemed to be the only first timer and the only one failing mechanics. I can't say how the rest of the raid went after the first fight, but for that one the party was mostly in good health. The only heals going out were minimal ones to top off raidwides.

Conversely in the second run there were a lot more first timers and the healers were scrambling to keep people alive, but they did well.

[VeyaAkemi]

Speaking for my personal style, whenever I am healing, I look at it like this, it takes approximately 3.2 GCD worth of cast time to hardcast a rez, which totals to roughly ~1000 potency worth of damage, it varies a little per Healer, can the DPS that is floortanking deal at least ~1000 potency worth of damage, even under Brink of Death, before they risk dropping again? if the answer is yes, I will gladly hardcast that rez, it will a benefit to the whole raid if they are up and doing damage, and if they are dropping that fast... eh... I am still going to rez them, just they will need to wait for the Swift to come back, no matter how sucky a player is, it just doesn't sit right with me to outright refuse to do the job I que'd for, doubly so if they are a first timer.

I get upset only if people get uppity with me, earlier this week I had a wipe on Cerberus in WoD, I was on SGE and died because the Wolvesbane adds attacked me and no Tank even tried picking them up, very quickly we are at a position where every Healer except one in another alliance is dead, we call for off-Alliance rezzes on chat, and completely ignored, we inevitably wipe, and I am still just vibing, it happens, I will just be more careful with the adds next run and bruteheal through them if needed... then the Healer that went radio silent earlier tries to yell at the raid for "not paying attention", and that is the point where I went from "just vibing" to completely livid, we wiped specifically because they were ignoring calls, the fight was completely salvageable if they had done their job, and the wipe was solely on their back, and they have the audacity to act like that? anyway, so long as you aren't acting like that, I will put up with most things, the real job of the Healer is to fix other people's mistakes anyhow.

[Merrigan]

I get upset only if people get uppity with me, earlier this week I had a wipe on Cerberus in WoD, I was on SGE and died because the Wolvesbane adds attacked me and no Tank even tried picking them up, very quickly we are at a position where every Healer except one in another alliance is dead, we call for off-Alliance rezzes on chat, and completely ignored, we inevitably wipe, and I am still just vibing, it happens, I will just be more careful with the adds next run and bruteheal through them if needed... then the Healer that went radio silent earlier tries to yell at the raid for "not paying attention", and that is the point where I went from "just vibing" to completely livid, we wiped specifically because they were ignoring calls, the fight was completely salvageable if they had done their job, and the wipe was solely on their back, and they have the audacity to act like that? anyway, so long as you aren't acting like that, I will put up with most things, the real job of the Healer is to fix other people's mistakes anyhow.

Hm. I'm not sure about your example: in practical terms he shouldn't have ignored the calls, but the primary fault lies with the other members. OK, his reaction is unsympathetic, but it's not ‘his fault’ or ‘his job’. A healer's job is normally to keep an eye on his team-mates, not all three alliances at once. The wipe is well and truly due to those who were killed unnecessarily / the tank that didn't taunt in your case.

[VeyaAkemi]

Hm. I'm not sure about your example: in practical terms he shouldn't have ignored the calls, but the primary fault lies with the other members. OK, his reaction is unsympathetic, but it's not ‘his fault’ or ‘his job’. A healer's job is normally to keep an eye on his team-mates, not all three alliances at once. The wipe is well and truly due to those who were killed unnecessarily / the tank that didn't taunt in your case.

All anyone was asking is throw a rez to another Healer, it's a common thing to do in alliances when things go astray, if I am healing and my alliance is doing fine, I will throw rezzes at a different alliance that is struggling even if both Healers are alive, all 24 players are ultimately working together there, and like I said, what ticked me off is the attitude, someone who had it within their power to avoid the outcome they were complaining about, and didn't even try to do it, is what ticks me off, crossing your arms and going "Well, I am not going to do it because it's not explicitly my job" is an attitude that helps nobody, especially not yourself, it's the same reason I will try my best to power through repeated player deaths, or why RDM/SMN who are able to salvage an encounter after the Healers bite it are valued.

People also need to be less averse to hardcasting rezzes, it's annoying but sometimes you just gotta do it, just make sure you are in a safe spot, usually immediately after a mechanic resolves is safe enough, and let that cast bar flow, but I did see a RDM hardcasting Verraise once, so maybe that was my monkey's paw moment.

[Merrigan]

All anyone was asking is throw a rez to another Healer, it's a common thing to do in alliances when things go astray, if I am healing and my alliance is doing fine, I will throw rezzes at a different alliance that is struggling even if both Healers are alive, all 24 players are ultimately working together there, and like I said, what ticked me off is the attitude, someone who had it within their power to avoid the outcome they were complaining about, and didn't even try to do it, is what ticks me off, crossing your arms and going "Well, I am not going to do it because it's not explicitly my job" is an attitude that helps nobody, especially not yourself, it's the same reason I will try my best to power through repeated player deaths, or why RDM/SMN who are able to salvage an encounter after the Healers bite it are valued.

People also need to be less averse to hardcasting rezzes, it's annoying but sometimes you just gotta do it, just make sure you are in a safe spot, usually immediately after a mechanic resolves is safe enough, and let that cast bar flow, but I did see a RDM hardcasting Verraise once, so maybe that was my monkey's paw moment.

The question isn't really whether or not he should have done it - I agree with you on that, even though I don't know what really happened and there may have been concerns that you didn't see. It's more the mentality of assuming that the fault lies with the player who couldn't compensate for the mistake that bothers me in your message: the mistake should be attributed to the player who made it, not to the guy who couldn't catch up for X or Y reason.

Here's an anecdote: I recently played Troïa in a dungeon. I was exhausted and died miserably against the secnod boss (yes, it's humiliating). The tank then took a ‘doom’, then yelled at the bard for not having the reflex to dispel. The bard really should have done it, but I defended him because the real worry was me, who had died pitifully as if I'd just started the game a fortnight ago. Not the bard, who just hadn't been able to compensate for my mistake.

Anyway, that's a bit of nitpicking on my part (... And probably a fair bit of ‘I'm fed up with people always blaming the healers ). That said, to pick up on another point: I've got the impression that people tend to have too much of a hardrez reflex? I've come across cohealers a few times who had the reflex to raise at all costs without taking into account the upcoming mechanics (and therefore the fact that they were going to be immobilised for a while).

[CamuiKushi]

Usually I will play SMN on raids I'm familiar with so I can throw out combat resses. Nier raids are STILL a pretty good example of a hardcast res coming in clutch sometimes lol

[Merrigan]

It's about the extremes, not the ‘normal’ runs, but please, when you sign up for a group that ‘farms’: if you have to ask if we all have to stay together behind the same meteors, then you're not ready for the ‘farm’